DeletedUser
Guest
I say family tribes work during the opening stages of the game.
DeletedUser
Guest
They will work because you said so? What are you basing that assessment on?
Is it because they will slow their growth with deadweight? Impede players growth with not enough targets and hampered farming? Or because having seven tribes in a family makes you bigger on the external maps?
Family tribes are paper tigers.
And I agree with Harb, family tribes make more sense in late world situations.
DeletedUser
Guest
Fear-Incarnate
Points 733
Rank 7550
Was that actually supposed to mean anything? or are you just soooo easy to impress
Fear Incarnate
| OD Rank: | 7225. (699 score) |
|---|---|
| OD Attack Rank: | 3807. (698 score) |
| OD Defense Rank: | 19703. (1 score) |
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mattcurr
Guest
All family tribes must have 7 tribes? All 7 tribes must be located near eachother? Dead weight cannot be cut? How is farming hurt? Unless you're farming wrong, which given that statement is probable. Just because some people do it wrong, it does not mean the concept is flawed. Like most people farm wrong dont know how to use LC, that doesnt mean you should think lc are bad for farming.
sp.ag
Guest
Fear-Incarnate
Points 733
Rank 7550
Was that actually supposed to mean anything? or are you just soooo easy to impress
Fear Incarnate
OD Rank: 7225. (699 score) OD Attack Rank: 3807. (698 score) OD Defense Rank: 19703. (1 score)
If one wishes to troll, one should get the victims name correct.
FEARinCarnate
Now you may continue.
DeletedUser18879
Guest
Fear-Incarnate
Points 733
Rank 7550
Was that actually supposed to mean anything? or are you just soooo easy to impress
Fear Incarnate
OD Rank: 7225. (699 score) OD Attack Rank: 3807. (698 score) OD Defense Rank: 19703. (1 score)
Damn, how did you find me? :icon_rolleyes:
spleen mage
Guest
There's no reason why a well organised family tribe could not work in early worlds - if anything, a good family tribe could probably dominate the world from start to finish. The only problem is that in the main, the people who normally create family tribes are the same type of people who don't seem to understand the game mechanics and mass recruit every single semi-active village in their area.
The problem isn't with family tribes per se, it's the people who run them.
DeletedUser
Guest
tl;dr : I agree that the problem isn't with family tribes, but that they are still entirely useless early world.
[SPOIL]Family tribes don't work early world because they are not needed. Decent tribes will trim down during the early stages rather than bulk members.
Take the core of 20-40 from a group and build on it later, as opposed to trying to create a core of 100 from the start. It's not to say that having 100 members is bad, it's that having 60-80 "bad members" is bad. Having a 20 good member tribe is not that different than a 20 good members + 80 bad one. The only difference is one has more cannon fodder, but cannon fodder is pointless during early stages anyway, just gives others growth.
I sort of agree with you in one sense, in that the problem isn't with the actual notion of family tribes, yet they are not actually useful early world anyway so it makes no sense to employ them that early regardless.
A handful of talented players can dominate a continent, numbers only begin to play part in later inter-K wars (which then, they do make a significant difference).
Family tribes can be useful for securing a path to the rim or borders, for example by absorbing a lot of the rim fishies rather than spending ages taking them out in the middle of a core war and directing their support, BUT, by that point it's out of "early world" so is irrelevant anyway.
So while family tribes are not as flawed in notion as people think, they are pretty much pointless early world since you are not going to have 40-60+ good players that early (even as a pre-made), and as a tribe you should only be investing in players that will be useful, defending and co-ordinating farms is just damaging to the better players potential. Even if it comes down to it, letting natural selection play out then creating a tribe from the dominant players is far better than the local family wars while everyone else grows bigger. If you do it that way, you would always be able to fill a single tribe with room to spare, as for every dominant player there is a dozen around him who are not. (By this logic you could also see at what point it would become useful to have a family tribe, in a world with thousands if you took the natural selection path.)[/SPOIL]
DeletedUser
Guest
But specific to World 66, where there is a tribe limit of 30 and a "No Allied Win" condition then family tribes are about as useful as a chocolate fireguard.
DeletedUser
Guest
It's entirely subjective.
There's a wierd drive to hate on family tribes, but as a rule you generally can't just say something is bad,it's entirely situational whether or not something is a good choice.
There's a wierd drive to hate on family tribes, but as a rule you generally can't just say something is bad,it's entirely situational whether or not something is a good choice.
DeletedUser
Guest
Lol ooops my fail[spoil]
[/spoil]
Now I'm just going to have to stalk the guy until I get another chance
DeletedUser
Guest
I honestly do not see the big deal of forming a family tribe, especially if it's a bunch of noobs. Why? Because if you have a tribe member limit of 30, and say all 30 players are twice the size of the average player int here K. It's only logical to match their size with numbers, and use it for there advantage. It's basic instinct, for the weak to crowd to gather as one great force. Calling it nooby is ridiculousness.
DeletedUser
Guest
The old safety in numbers game eh?[spoil]
[/spoil]
DeletedUser
Guest
It's nooby.
Except that it doesn't work that way at all. By your own words:
If you have 10 players that equal the strength of 1, in what way have they gained any advantage there?
There is no advantage because of the fact that now they have to massively communicate and co-ordinate in order to keep up with the *same level* of "logistics" that the solo player has (as he knows exactly what he is doing at all times, unlike the "team" that has 10 heads and is trying to decide what each is doing).
Given that, as you said, we are talking about the weak, the very fact they have a poor army and a poor village means that they don't have high levels of organization and knowledge required to actually effectively micro manage that many armies in the first place. It is so much harder to efficiently co-ordinate 10 people against a top player than it is 1, because of the fact that the timings have to be seamless and everyone on the same level. Impossible with your average family tribe player.
NOW, if it was a case of "the noobs crowding together to have a stronger force", then, possibly. Sure. If they ended up with a force at least *10-20 times* that of the player, due to the fact they have the handicaps mentioned. However, usually they are barely equal, or have a tiny numbers advantage that is lost due to poor micro management and co-ordination (and no, "everyone attack this guy" is not effective co-ordination against any above average player).
Edit: I also forgot to mention the key thing. You can't win in that situation without being offensive (because if you sit defensive you will just be outgrown and lose automatically).
... Attacks don't stack. You can throw a million single spears at a stack, but it doesn't mean you attacked with a million spears.
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DeletedUser104941
Guest
You are clearly an idiot.
How is being warm while at the same time having your fireplace covered in melted chocolate not a desirable outcome?.
:icon_rolleyes:
DeletedUser40486
Guest
The old safety in numbers game eh?[spoil]
[/spoil]
O' sir mike fisher you just made my day - that is one to to prove one's point lolzzzz
DeletedUser
Guest
Whoa, spleen, you're still around? I just came back after a couple years of absence, if you are playing in this world too, that makes 3 people I know are in this world.
DeletedUser
Guest
DeletedUser
Guest
I find your statement amusing, and when I say amusing I mean a joke. No disrespect, but the idea that a single player can take on 10 people whom match him in power. Still has a advantage due to micro, when on the contrary he's being out matched in micro and macro. How(You must be asking)? All these 10 players have to do is send massive defense towards a village, that one player is attacking. Once he runs out of troops, which he will. He'll have to rebuild, within 24hrs all those 10 players combined will have 10x the amount of army populous he does. With a good Captain 5 villages go defensive and 5 go offensive, not only will he lose the next battle but he'll be farmed. Said process will repeat it's self, and that 1 player loses.
Good players are valuable, but noobs aren't completely useless. We're all noobs, but we'll get better from someone teaching and commanding, or perhaps from experience. It doesn't matter, out of 5/10 noobs will become good or at least useful. All it takes is 1 pro, and noobs who are willing to learn, which is why family tribes are useful. Teamwork is essential but not impossible,you may agree or disagree. But lets agree to disagree.
Good players are valuable, but noobs aren't completely useless. We're all noobs, but we'll get better from someone teaching and commanding, or perhaps from experience. It doesn't matter, out of 5/10 noobs will become good or at least useful. All it takes is 1 pro, and noobs who are willing to learn, which is why family tribes are useful. Teamwork is essential but not impossible,you may agree or disagree. But lets agree to disagree.
DeletedUser90609
Guest
In my experience in the game i have seen a fair few family tribes do very well in worlds. For example the !?!.f of w35. they internalled players quickly, and opps were planned excellently. the organisation of the three tribes !?!, !@! and !$! was excellent orders from the lead duke would be followed through, they held 50% of the world for a good few months from mid-game to late game. then the duke (aetost) quit and mailed the entire family to mass quit and spend time with their families, many did so and that was the end of the run of the !?!.f. they recruited out towards the rim those that were worth recruiting many "newbs" were recruited and taught how to play the game. and those that showed no promise were eaten.
I don't think !?! would have done so well had they been a family from the start, but it worked brilliantly for them when they decided to form a family. therefore families are not awful.
I don't think !?! would have done so well had they been a family from the start, but it worked brilliantly for them when they decided to form a family. therefore families are not awful.
