Defiition of a Refugee?

One Last Shot...

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Hi all.

For those of you who don't know me: I'm one of the players on the Lucaya account. I'd like to set up a discussion thread. This is based around the topic of "refugees".


I'll give a backstory, to show the reason why this is an interesting topic to me & to give a basic topic to be discussed before others throw in their experiences.

[SPOIL]Ok, so as you will most likely know, Pacman folded. A number of members went to MANIC. When asked by my previous tribe-mates to join them, I refused on the basis that I don't join tribes I view as an enemy, as we had previously been fighting them. I had no incoming attacks from MANIC for a long period of time (must be a couple of weeks at least now), and MANIC member(s) had since contacted me in an attempt to recruit us to MANIC - which clearly hasn't worked, and won't, owing to the childishness of the duke of this tribe.

However, for a bit of fun my coplayer and I began talking to a couple of friends on this world, and set up a 3-man tribe. Attempts to recruit Lucaya account to MANIC continued.

After deliberation, it seemed that CM would be the most enjoyable tribe to join. MANIC seems very upset by this, and so made contact with our new tribe after failing to convince us that MANIC is a half-decent, respectable tribe to join, claiming that we are a refugee. However, there have still been no attacks in a long period of time.[/SPOIL]


Therefore, what I would like to discuss is this:


Do you consider someone a refugee if you put a huge amount of time in to trying to convince them to join your tribe, and then they don't join, but no attacks are exchanged for the entire period?


Personally, I'd say not. Unless there are very recent conflicts, or ongoing conflicts, or a clear loss of villages, a player doesn't count as a refugee. I'd just be interested to see other people's thoughts on what a refugee is - feel free to use the example I personally have provided, or use your own experiences to add to the topic :)
 

DeletedUser

Guest
personally id say no, that doesnt define a refugee. however with CM recent recruitment in K35/K36 that is recruiting refugees since war was declared less then a week ago.

wrong thread -.-
 
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DeletedUser

Guest
Refugees are people who join a tribe just for protection and nothing else.

Lol you wrote a whole essay for nothing! "What's a refugee?" would have prevailed lmao
 

DeletedUser

Guest
From the TW wiki:
Refugee: A player that is under attack, and looking for a tribe to join, in order to get protection from them.

That's essentially my view. So in this case, you wouldn't be a refugee. You weren't under attack, and you weren't seeking protection.
 

Bcardi

Guest
Manic would be crazy to try and call Lucaya account a refugee.
 

ex cultu rex

Guest
Well, I don't think anyone would call you a refugee. In all likelihood it's just an attempt by Manic to limit your options and gain the upper hand in attempts to recruit you. However that said, methinks you are slightly too JustinBieber&RebeccaBlack!JustinBieber&RebeccaBlack!JustinBieber&RebeccaBlack!JustinBieber&RebeccaBlack!JustinBieber&RebeccaBlack! not to have already known what the response to this thread was going to...
 

DeletedUser

Guest
May want to query this with Warstiner then. As he has done it multiple times since we joined CM :icon_razz:

we exist in our small world up in K35 currently :icon_razz:

but i will say the lot they just recruited; Nuke On Fire and the other lot are refugees, im not sure about you seeing as you havent been recently attacked but then again what do i know :lol:

im just some dumb hick lives in the middle of nowhere :icon_cool:
 

netjakdim

Guest
There really should be a time frame established on Refugees. I remember some newb on 24 tried to tell me that a player his tribe had not attacked for about 2 months according to noblings and when asked for reports claimed he did not save them.
So as he was being a prick about it, we recruited the guys anyway and since we knew he his tribe was about to merge into one of our allies. We started scouting all of his villages and I so graciously requested from our ally that he not be recruited as I had reports to prove he was a refugee and an enemy of our tribe.
It was right funny all of his tribe but him and 5 other accounts that were probably inactive were recruited and within 2 weeks he was sitting in a nice cozy little estate on the rim.
 

One Last Shot...

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Perhaps. But Warstiner was specifying Lucaya count directly (as in, he stated Lucaya account was a refugee and demanded we be dismissed because of it). So I would assume that Warstiner seems to think that failed attempts at taking out Lucaya account, and a bunch of fakes, all of which are long in the past now, is enough to claim us as a refugee. Would be like calling France a refugee now for WWII. Completely pointless :)
 

DeletedUser

Guest
I define a refugee as someone who has been recently had a series of attacks to their village(s), been cleared, is in the and/or process of nobled. Perhaps, or perhaps not, been sent a threatening message of intent accompanied by scouting/regular attacks.


A refugee essentially is, by behavior, a stray musk oxen calf within the herd or new tribe.

Muskoxen - Wikipedia
Muskoxen have a distinctive defensive behavior: when the herd is threatened, the bulls and cows will face outward to form a stationary ring or semicircle around the calves.[27] The bulls are usually the front line for defense against predators with the cows and juveniles gathering close to them.[19] Bulls determine the defensive formation during rutting while the cows decide the rest of the year.[25]
 
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netjakdim

Guest
Seriously just kick him then have about 20 villages to stack him and let him declare war on them then when the results of caps show such an outrageous despartiy they will have no choice but to call a cease fire.
Make sure though to declare war on him as well that way when he takes villages you guys can take them off of him to keep the morale at the suk level and he can keep pounding away. Then when they whine about it you guys are only attacking a player you are at war with after the way he tricked your tribe into letting him join.
 

DeletedUser102250

Guest
Perhaps. But Warstiner was specifying Lucaya count directly (as in, he stated Lucaya account was a refugee and demanded we be dismissed because of it). So I would assume that Warstiner seems to think that failed attempts at taking out Lucaya account, and a bunch of fakes, all of which are long in the past now, is enough to claim us as a refugee. Would be like calling France a refugee now for WWII. Completely pointless :)

If the player hasn't lost villages, or a few for bigger accounts, and they still have their troops I wouldn't consider them a refugee, especially if the attacks have stopped for a while.
 

HorseSoldier

Guest
In my opinion a refugee is a former member of a tribe that was warring another tribe. It is the latter tribe's right to declare him/her as a refugee if they want and is also they're job to do something about it if they choose to use that label.

Being a refugee isn't always that bad of a title. Embrace it and tell them to come on and do something about it. I always laugh at tribes that say they won't recruit refugees no matter the circumstance. Some refugees are worth it to thumb your nose at the labelers and fight for it.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
My definition of a refugee is simple. If you are in a tribe that is either in a war or being attacked, and you leave because of the attacks/war(Some like to make excuses on why they left). If you have already been attacked (recently), and cleared, then you try to join a tribe, you are a refugee. If you are attacked, and you kill the attacker(s), I would not consider you a refugee.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
Do you consider someone a refugee if you put a huge amount of time in to trying to convince them to join your tribe, and then they don't join, but no attacks are exchanged for the entire period?

In your case i doubt anyone could call you a refugee, but than again in general, the bigger and more powerful tribes always have and always will have their own definition of a refugee, depending of course whether it benefits them or not.
Moral of the story, be big and powerful so you can bully people :scout:
 

DeletedUser

Guest
Hi all.
Do you consider someone a refugee if you put a huge amount of time in to trying to convince them to join your tribe, and then they don't join, but no attacks are exchanged for the entire period?

If i am trying to convince someone to join it's obvious that i would ask people not to attack until negotiation are finalized. If you have clearly said that you would not join and there was some interval between your answer and time to join new tribe then not a refugee. If you said that you would not join and join the next tribe within a day or two then obviously refugee case.
The reason for pacman quitting was that they were not active enough now if you are active then are we to assume you ran from a fight :icon_wink:
 

DeletedUser

Guest
^ actually the account was inactive before i coplay the account. :p
 

DeletedUser26129

Guest
MANIC rules state that every player that was planned for elimination, or previous had been under attack by MANIC, attacked in an operation by MANIC, or attacked MANIC members will be seen as a refugee and will be dealt with accordingly...

MANIC is greedy....
 
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