Discussion: New account manager

DeletedUser

Guest
I agree that AM is a huge help for people with giant accounts, and i also agree that for people with small accounts it does literally all the work.

Thats because as the world gets older, gameplay itself actually changes! From micro to macro to ending with almost entirely macro... Thats why i think this should be targeted at players over 100 villages ORRRRR
unlock it after say 1 year in the world. or 6 months or whatever.
 

ramz fan

Guest
I think that it just adds those numbers repeatedly whenever possible, seeing as I have 3 sets of 10 rams queued up. I would like to speak with someone in charge of the AM about getting the troop templates and village templates to stay on the villages even after they are finished. The village manager is awesome and works fine. But I believe that using mass scripts works better than the troop manager because of the removal of templates after building.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
My personal opinion is that this was a terrible/ awesome update.. i agree with some of the thing's you've included, such as the script which is the equivalent to a mass recruitment script.

what im not a fan of is barb farming.. i may aswell go back to playing Medieval total war if this game is just going to be people with pp blitzkrieging, people without, this has simply set another roadblock in between veteran and new player's.

what's next? an auto snipe manager which snipe's trains for you, come on tw bring back the value of the "player" not the "premium"

When I started W13, then I farmed the barbs in my whole continent. I avoided attention by sending a minimum amount of troops without losses to different villages, they all came back with full resources. A lot can be done, but it takes time to do it. With more time, we can do much more and raise activity levels. You don't just need to farm barbs, you can put focus on different issues as well. I were playing W5 as well, so I quit W13 in the long run due to the lack of time.

Most players are ordinary members. However, when you step up in the chain and takes responsibilities, then we'll notice that there's less time available for yourself. I'm sure that the farming manager will save a lot of time for players who don't have all the time that mainly younger ones do. Farming barbs isn't dumb while you're growing up, at one stage when you fight enemies, you would want to farm them. Not to mention, anyone who lasted a long time in a former world, would easily do well in a new one, unless there's someone better around the corner. So new players will rarely survive, if they lose on their first world, then they'll likely not be back. The farm manager will surely help them. It'll be easy to learn the game, but hard to master.

When you get large, then farming wont be attractive, or it would be rare for it to be. as in older worlds, we're super stacked and 500-1000 nukes are a drop in the sea, unless you're right next to the target.

I told the other guy that he could either spend money and save time, or spend time and in turn make less money. Finding one who both got the time and money is rare. And yes, the account manager will make a large difference, just as premium from none premium do. I had one member who got up to either 3 or 6 millions without premium, I couldn't handle it after 600k. So we all got different limits, now we get a choice of spending time or money.

And _Grimlock_
I got no idea how the research manager would work, as I only play in an old world. I would only want a template with all the researches being done as buildings are upgraded or hitting one button.
But it could likely be useful, if it were just to use a template, specially now since many of us will pay others to take small pointers in our backs to grow defensive villages.

Typhon will surely take note of it as he's keeping an eye here it seems. He or someone else will likely update us about what kind of improvements they'll look over after they discussed it, it'll likely take a few days. Well, hopefully not a month

And yes, it's all an overkill for small players. A time limit wont do much, as every would got a different speed and some gets stuck in a stalemate without barely any gains on any side for a long period. Either the administration upgrade the account manager when they feel it's ready, possible in several steps. Or it becomes available per player as they grow. Of course it would be best estimated by comparing villages to points. Some might noble tons of barbs, some other max out their villages just to get their features.

Once you get past the limit, you wouldn't lose the account manager feature. It would make people race to specific levels of the account manager.
And the gameplay need to change in old worlds as well, like the recent improvement. It's a nightmare to look for nobles in large accounts, specially when you noble in several areas now and then. As such you can just check in the academy where all nobles are placed.

I have likely swapped around 40-60 owners at least, in my tribe. Most quit when they start or get occupied at University, it's often common to quit as you search for a new job after. People who got themselves works are likely to return as they're settled down, however nearly everyone who gets a new job, always gets overwhelmed and are quickly replaced or stays inactive. It could be good to point out that some quit saying "It's just the same old shit over and over again", meaning that the game just got incredible boring. If more can be done in less time, then people might not be exhausted as quickly.

And Phoenix2050. As when I lead a tribe, the updates are useful for the overall amount of members. As they make updates we need to change play style now and then, the issue we all face is that the scripts can stop working until a new ones are made a week or two after. And they got to update the code for all the worlds, since it's a nightmare to have 57+ different codes. To implement new and good features, better code will always be needed.

There's always a few hardcore players who makes it without the upgrades. But that's only a handful, as a hardcore player, would you like when players on both sides just delete or seeing that everyone are just inactive? In the end you'll only see the hardcore players and inactives left, and they would delete by being bored. So updates are are always needed as it's a nightmare to handle tons of different source codes. And nothing is worse than editing shit code, I don't believe that Innogames were made of highly skilled programmers with a perfect structure, specially not when they likely didn't aim to get the best programmers from their start.

More can likely be done after the updates, with better code, it'll be easier to implement new features. As said, nothing is worse than shit code where you always wonder what the one before really tried to do. Not to mention, I'm sure that you use a lot of updates which came after the start. Not all updates are as horrible like the context menu, it's so slow that I don't use it myself. It just gets in my way.

And remember, that skilled players, rarely top ranked ones, Are hard to take down and you rarely start with them. As the world grows, you fight in a tribe. The tribes around always look for easy targets, for weak spots. Skilled players are brought down with the rest of the tribe as support will be limited once an enemy break through the front-lines. If less of these flaws exist, then it would improve your situation as well.

And the Account manager covers far from everything. There's much more possible improvement which most of us keep for ourselves, since we get around it.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
Another feature:

When I make operation, then I gather troop number from the whole tribe. What I often ask for is how many nukes that're currently ready.
I do also want to know how many that will be ready in X number of days.

Some got a hard time to count their nukes, and learning scripts for it isn't easy for everyone.
The script counts after farm space. The used farm space will be shown as Full, 4/4, 3/4, 2/4, 1/4 or 0, I actually don't remember how that one works.
Of course when recruiting and the farm space is all used, doesn't it mean that the villages are ready. Which is why when the village is full and no recruiting is being done it could be marked as Full or Ready in a number.

So it would be 5 fields, like those marked in black. They would all have numbers under themselves.


If this could be made to either a basic or account manager feature it would help a lot, specially when operations are being planned. It can take time for players to count these numbers, a lot have the time, but it's boring. Of course it would be better as a basic feature as everyone wont use the account manager.

Another improvement on this idea could be if it's possible to count returning nukes and in what shape they're in.

You might have nukes sent out and much are returning. However since you sent 1300 nukes, it could be hard to count what is usable once the returned.

So it would in the end be possible to have two fields. One for what is at home, and another for what is away.
Nukes that are either returning or outside of the village would be seen as Away.

If you got a hell lot of use, then you use them several times a week. With larger amounts, it can be hard to count them.
It should be counted per group, as per page is rarely interesting, if possible.


It would take a lot of bandwidth if the "view" were to estimate these number every time. So the easiest way would be to just have a button to press.

I do ask for defensive villages now and then as well, this feature would be useful in that case as well. It's likely even harder to count defensive villages, the reason for that is because the majority rarely dies.

It isn't uncommon to have tons of scrap everywhere, another feature with the account manager could be to split up and send the scrap villages to the villages they're currently supporting. That would safe a lot of support as lost support needs to be re-stacked, when they're then re-stacked, it means no need for more support. Support wouldn't be sent back unless that front would be safe, or that by this feature, some noticing that they suddenly have way more support than they need.

There should be scripts for sending out scrap villages, but again it isn't interesting on huge accounts.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
Thats not skill it's just having massive amount of time to micromanage, a lot of people would rather skip the building bit and spend their time attacking other players, rather than lazily noble small barbs and spend ages building them up.

just pointing out that this is wrong and what greenshell was talking about really is about skill.... organisation means everything and to me AM is just another tool to keep casual/lazy players around for a bit longer. i say this as someone who went from being unemployed to working 12 hour shifts and moving house and so could only spend 10-15 minutes on my account a day (if i was lucky). as a result i lost 6mil in the last 6 or 7 weeks. had the AM been available 2 months ago for me i still wouldnt have used it. it just makes it too easy to become lazy with it and make people feel that they can hide behind it perhaps to avoid being what some would see as a "good" tribemate and just ride on the backs of those that do put effort in and you get enough of those as it is.
 

busamad

Contributing Poster
Reaction score
34
haza teh great @ Its called an account manager & thats the aim of it I fail to see now that changes anything within the game. You still have to noble villages attack players & put thought into what to build / recruit.

From reading the little how to guide for me I just do not have enough spare time to work out all the settings needed to use it as my systems are in place & work OK for me I will just keep using them & save the extra money needed to run this feature.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
At the moment, you will only need the Account manager for two weeks for building/demolishing villages. Unless the case is that like one of my members having 1000 nobles available, he could noble every 100 pointer around and grow them up.

haza teh great.
I still say that 10-15 minutes spent ingame, rarely show a skill. You need to spend hours, several days or weeks in a row once you're under larger attacks. On good fronts, towards good tribes, 10-15 minutes wont cut it, unless you're very heavily stacked. If you are going to send nukes or support, then it can take hours if it's large amounts. Unless you send them via a large amounts of tabs in opera.

And if you got any sense of responsibility, then you need to check in more often and send support which is specially true on active front-lines. 10-15 minutes is called inactivity on a front, that means that the guy in question is in most cases a preferred target. If we get 23 hours, before someone gets notice of the attacks, then it's a huge success already. 10-15 minutes online for a duke only exist in a pure inactive tribe that will fall. Or in a tribe where every member work on their own without involvement of a leader, where other players are more of a leader compared to the duke. Greenshell hardly knew what he were talking about, his opinion only fit his scenario.

The account manger will improve several features and save time, but it still need a lot of work. While a tribe have good members, there're also bad ones and less active. All these good players take turns in being active and it vary, otherwise my tribe would have won W5 long ago. But people get busy and quit. What if they didn't get busy and quit? When fighting as a tribe, then you'll be dragged down by the bad or inactive players after you loses one of three safe fronts. Suddenly you lack support and becomes an easy target.

Remember that it's very easy to take out any skilled player, as long that this one can't manage to get support and having enemy nukes bringing down his walls. Cat the guy for a months and he's close to gone or will hit delete. So in the end, it's useless if Tw only prioritize hardcore players, since these are barely a few percent of the total amount of players. A player who only spends 10-15 minutes in the game, is someone I would personally ask to quit and replace, that kind of inactivity often hurts the tribe more than anything else as the player will always be late. I have had guys who sound as greenshell, they did manage their account good.

However once they're attacked, then you're set as sitter and always got to clean up their mess which often becomes a disappointment. In my tribe, we got two main fronts(We really only got a tiny safe front, the rest of the front is red) and we lost half of the south front long ago due to people being lazy and not keeping an eye on their account. If Greenshell is the kind of player I believe he's, then he should be replaced immediately or his tribe would face considerable issues once he becomes a target. So the lazy and ignorant one, is the one who would only be online for 10-15 minutes.
If you can't be online more, then it's better to swap accounts with one in the back. People deep-in doesn't need to be as active like a front-player. I have swapped several players who got busy and put them in accounts deeper in, they were satisfied that they didn't have a front to worry about.

And if you're still just going to play 10-15 minutes, then the Account manager will have another good point. You can activate notifications which will send a mail to a specified address. This would likely be more useful than the Tw toolbar if you were to stay longer times on a work. As it doesn't always look good to have links to games if it's kind installed on a work computer, it isn't accepted at most jobs out there. A mail is easier to get away with, quickly login and get a sitter.

The account manager got good points, and Typhon will surely get it improved as well. It'll get better as time pass. Most of us here see the use of it, and the use it'll be once improved. We shouldn't throw the idea down the river, just because a few doesn't have any use of it yet.

Good organisation is useless, if the enemy got no issue to speed noble you. Mass scouting, 500-1000 close-range nukes an hour after and your front being speed nobling in no time won't make you popular.

I get every possible detail, hence the wall of text. Only the one with no life read these, as I don't read them myself.
 

yeolde raven

Guest
Yes it's wonderful the way it removes the template from vills after recruiting all the troops, so you have to reset it when you lose your troops, hardly a great timesaver.
Your vill gets catted and you can quickly set it to build your vill again, but lose troops and you have to go through a long process.
Plus why when recruiting does Troop Manager decide to add other units, yes please I want 50 swords with my nukes.
 

Shadryk 01

Guest
Issues & Feedback:

1) The Troop Manager builds only a very small number of troops at a time and leaves a lot of resources. Almost seems like it builds only when the warehouse is full of one resource (can't really tell.) Villages that are almost full are not being topped off with troops. My buffers are all set to zero. It would be best if it would use all resources available, so when I mint coins or run my market script, I will not drain resources that should be used for making troops.

2) I am unable to figure out which troop templates I applied to which villages. There should be a label.

3) The Village appears to lose the village template once the buildings are set to their desired levels. If so, if my walls get dropped or buildings damaged, I will need to manually reapply the template to get them built again. The template should be sticky, and the village should be labeled accordingly.

4) The Market tool seems to direct a stream of resources to designated villages on a schedule. I think the best use for this feature would be to duplicate and automate the market balancing script that is popular with many players. That script takes a lot of time to run and does require some learning. This would be consistent with the general theme of this upgrade. I can see people paying to have this task automated. Sending resources to village X is a minor function.

5) The Farming tool is less impactful than some 3rd party tools that are in use today. I do not know why a player would pay money for a less efficient system that is currently free. I assume the farming itself if not automated, but requires mouseclicks.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
Issues & Feedback:


4) The Market tool seems to direct a stream of resources to designated villages on a schedule. I think the best use for this feature would be to duplicate and automate the market balancing script that is popular with many players. That script takes a lot of time to run and does require some learning. This would be consistent with the general theme of this upgrade. I can see people paying to have this task automated. Sending resources to village X is a minor function.

I would not advise any corporation to poach another's intellectual property, however TW gradually making new premium features to replace (rather than duplicate) what have become considered essential scripts & tools appears to be part of the wave of game improvements, & seems reasonable in terms of listening to what the customer base is looking for & then supplying it.
 

busamad

Contributing Poster
Reaction score
34
Shadryk 01 @ I'm now starting to understand why the village & troop templates are removed as without removal it does put too much of the account on auto pilot which would give a massive gain on none AM players.
If they were kept in place it would mean all that's left for you to do is attack / support where needed & set in motion the auto build of a village. Which to me is taking things a step too far.
 

DeletedUser910

Guest
Thats not skill it's just having massive amount of time to micromanage, a lot of people would rather skip the building bit and spend their time attacking other players, rather than lazily noble small barbs and spend ages building them up.

It still give an advantage to player who can afford to spend another 200 points on this AM app. To me, I think it's just here to make the developers more money. If it was here to actually help members, it would have been added to the current premium. Even if they were going to charge for it, 50 premium pts would have been enough. Because of this type of gouging I most likely won't return once my worlds end as well. The game is pretty much unplayable without premium. Most of the people who quit or go inactive do so because they can't afford premium. Now they add this and expect player to pay even more. lol!! NO!.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
It wouldn't hurt if it were cheaper yes. And yes, a lot of players quit because of premium. My tribe would lose half its members if I didn't pay for them.

I'm willing to pay around two account managers for two players who will mass noble 100 pointers and get more defensive villages. Since I already pay half of the tribe, another 200 points per member wont be possible as it'll just not be worth the cost.

The account manager can be worth 200 points for me and several others if several of my ideas are implemented, if it were to become a lot better, then I would possible give certain key players who can give my tribe an advantage on the front more premium. I got a lot of good idea, people just got to read through it(preferable make a lined list, as I lack time for that.), or if Typhon could list possible good ideas that they're overlooking, it'll certainly give a clearer picture.

The current features are at most worth 50 points. The mass recruiting still goes quicker by scripts, unless we could attach templates to groups and just select "Use template".

Those who often develop likely doesn't play constantly, we could surely post scripts here that they would work after and reasons why it's more useful.

Not to mention, programmers often have a geek/nerd gene. Whatever they make is holy, it wouldn't be strange if that is an issue which can stop improvement as it's already perfect in their eyes. Hence post what is needed and ways of improvements with reasons. We shouldn't forget that the Account manager is new, they likely just wanted a quick way of pumping in extra cash, or ran out of ideas. They surely know that it's to expensive for what feature it gives, when comparing to many of the players. Innogames have never had any good reason, when they're are planning to gain that little extra cash.
 

ramz fan

Guest
Issues & Feedback:

1) The Troop Manager builds only a very small number of troops at a time and leaves a lot of resources. Almost seems like it builds only when the warehouse is full of one resource (can't really tell.) Villages that are almost full are not being topped off with troops. My buffers are all set to zero. It would be best if it would use all resources available, so when I mint coins or run my market script, I will not drain resources that should be used for making troops.

2) I am unable to figure out which troop templates I applied to which villages. There should be a label.

3) The Village appears to lose the village template once the buildings are set to their desired levels. If so, if my walls get dropped or buildings damaged, I will need to manually reapply the template to get them built again. The template should be sticky, and the village should be labeled accordingly.

4) The Market tool seems to direct a stream of resources to designated villages on a schedule. I think the best use for this feature would be to duplicate and automate the market balancing script that is popular with many players. That script takes a lot of time to run and does require some learning. This would be consistent with the general theme of this upgrade. I can see people paying to have this task automated. Sending resources to village X is a minor function.

5) The Farming tool is less impactful than some 3rd party tools that are in use today. I do not know why a player would pay money for a less efficient system that is currently free. I assume the farming itself if not automated, but requires mouseclicks.

+1 very insightful, took the letters right out of my keyboard haha
 

Shadryk 01

Guest
I would not advise any corporation to poach another's intellectual property, however TW gradually making new premium features to replace (rather than duplicate) what have become considered essential scripts & tools.....

We're advocating the same issue, mate. I am not suggesting TW copy the exact script. Rather, duplicate the effect with an in-game solution so that the script is no longer necessary. I don't post a lot, but I've argued elsewhere that the dev team should look first to the scripts being used, then update the game in a way that would make the scripts obsolete. That makes the game more assessable to casual and new players, and promotes player retention.

Shadryk 01 @ I'm now starting to understand why the village & troop templates are removed as without removal it does put too much of the account on auto pilot which would give a massive gain on none AM players.
If they were kept in place it would mean all that's left for you to do is attack / support where needed & set in motion the auto build of a village. Which to me is taking things a step too far.

I hear your point (and it's valid), but that argument has been settled. TW decided to move forward with AM. Since it's here, my feedback is intended to help them make it as useful as possible.

On your point, if you look at Grepolis (another InnoGames product) they have 5 premium features, each costing 200 points/month. They are as follows:

1) Account tools comparable to TW Premium
2) Mines make 30% more
3) "Mythical" troops are 20% more powerful
4) Ground troops are 20% more powerful
5) Naval troops are 20% more powerful & merchants travel twice as fast

The AM feature is intended to save mouseclicks. It does not provide a direct combat advantage. That's a far cry from Greopolis (and many other on-line games) which allow you to spend your way to glory and conquest.

+1 very insightful, took the letters right out of my keyboard haha

Thankie, thankie..... :lol:
 
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DeletedUser

Guest
Shadryk 01 @ I'm now starting to understand why the village & troop templates are removed as without removal it does put too much of the account on auto pilot which would give a massive gain on none AM players.
If they were kept in place it would mean all that's left for you to do is attack / support where needed & set in motion the auto build of a village. Which to me is taking things a step too far.

That logic makes some sense. Stops people relying on the AM when attacked to build up walls and troops straight away.

On the flip side, it also makes it a slightly redundant feature. If I'm going to have to constantly reassign templates to all the villages, I may as well just use a mass-recruit script. Seems to me that the main benefit of AM will be as stop-gap substitute when the scripts get broken each update.



Village build I haven't played with just yet, though with as I have one village build that might prove slightly more effective as I can assign all villages to the template at once.

And it's too expensive for what it is.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
@xJezuzx

I completely agree with everything you have said here.

@Those who disagree

There is nothing clever or skillful about going through 100's of villages building walls when an automated system can do it in seconds. You don't get the CEO of a company going to the assembly line putting things in boxes, he/she just masterminds the process. To mechanize the tedious aspects of the game is a great thing, the game has plenty of depth so you still have to use your skill and knowledge no matter what the game can automate for you.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
Good to hear that many of us share the same points.

Another good feature would be education of nobles right on the map Overview.

It can be a be a good idea that you can select a village and have the option "Recruit Nobles until the X amount", where X would indicate a total number of nobles. It must be able to be used in a ordinary map overview and possible in the context menu, most of us who would make use of the feature likely doesn't use the map overview. The map overview cause an uncountable amount of issues and slows you down like hell once you're looking around your villages. It might look good, but it's really the worst feature introduced.

Why I personally need this feature, is because that I mass educate nobles before operations. I might need to educate around 150 or more, and Tw doesn't swap or change pages in less than seconds.
So it's a nightmare of work, specially if you got a lot of information in the pop-up feature, when dragging the mouse over villages.

150 nobles are a a low amount to educate, it need improvements if possible. I can't see which of the villages I would want to educate nobles from in a troop overview. I got to hand-pick villages.
 

busamad

Contributing Poster
Reaction score
34
There is no skill in using a script to ID attacks either come on just how far do you want things to go in this game.
In late game defending a large account is easy its very hard as an attacker to break the will of the player & start to gain ground do you really want any troops killed & walls to be instantly upgraded. there has to be some player interaction to save an account or the game just become pointless.

As for nobles I also look at each village in where to make nobles before attacks but have to kill off troops to make trains ect so see no point in such a feature.
Its a bit of a waste of farm space if in every village you have 400 / 500 slots spare.
 
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