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I swore I wouldn't do this, but you guys know me, for the sake of my sanity, I just have to deal with it. Figured GD was a fair enough place to have it out (I apologise if it's not, Or-el).
Let's go through Xsha's reply to mine:
[spoil]
Fair enough. Nothing to dispute here.
Un-true. I have gone through all of our defense threads and skype chats - I see you sending D on maybe 5/6 occassions that were made public. A few others sent a lot more.
You keep alluding to the fact that Code declared and that Toasty stepped down; however, this does not change what happened. We carried out ops on Vesve with Ohyeah (and other local players), and we kept pushing forward. If you had read a lot of our shared forum, we had several "mini-ops" running.
Also, after Toasty left and a few others left with him, we didn't have the manpower for a large op. People were fighting tooth and nail because some people didn't send D and some people didn't sit and too many were "inactive" (ie logging in once every two days and doing pretty much nothing - but still being online every so often.) We ran mini-ops and I have multiple skype chats to prove it. Plus if you analyse our conquer history, you'll notice where the ops crop up. Check for instance correlation between myself/Knightofthespirit/Angel and Ohyeah players in K53. You'll find a few common targets/roughly same landing times. Also, we asked for nukes hundreds of times to help clear targets - did you send? The answer is no.
Part 1) If people are wrong, they inadvertently mention it, especially as a slip of the tongue or by accident. Otherwise, how would we ever know that someone is wrong, if they didn't act on it or talk about it? We can't read minds. Yet.
As for the guides, here is example number one, in which you actually WROTE A RESPONSE.
*****PLEASE NOTE THE DATE; it is one of several guides******
[spoil]Gregoun on 13.08.2011 at 00:18Quote Edit
THIS IS A LONG BUT NECESSARY POST ABOUT DEFENDING AND SITTING. It should help some players.
Guys, this is becoming a slowly worse and worse situation. We've got so many people on vacation, the rest of us need to help out with sitting. Yes, this will involve sniping. Anyone who does know how to snipe at this stage is just plain....argh!
Even in the worst of times; a little bit of thinking and not being scared can help. The worst thing to do on this, and indeed any war game, is panic.
I'm gonna go through how things should go for defending an account:
If you get a sit, especially one with loads of untagged incomings; the one thing you cannot do is panic and go "Meh, I'll just leave it, it's not my account" - because it will be your account next.
You're all going to have to become comfortable with sniping. Because, if you don't try snipes, the account owner will end up losing anyway. A try and failed snipe is better then sitting for 6 hours going "Can anyone sit and snipe please? It's urgent" and losing 15 villages in that. The more you try, the more confident you get. No-one makes every single snipe. You will lose villages, you will have to get used to that.
A few things about teamwork:
People need to recap villages which are going to be a dead loss and are just a drain to defend. Sometimes, it's easier to let a village go then to stack or snipe it. Most of our enemies don't bother sending D to land after the noble (minus a few guys in Code, and two in Haul). Therefore, if all else fails, go for the recap!
WORK WITH THE PEOPLE IN YOUR AREA. IF YOU NEED D, ASK THEM. If they can't give it, go for the recap. But for god's sakes, don't be the strong and silent type.
Right, things to do for a sit, especially a FRONTLINE sit:
Things to do if you're passing off a sit:
Right, time for a bit of work on sniping:
SNIPING IS EASY. There's nothing to be afraid of.
First things first, figure out what you know about the attacker. Chat to team mates, see how they like to send. Every attacker has a pattern. I have one, we all have one. We like our set routines that make us succesful - hardly anyone ever changes it up. Humans are predictable end of.
For instance, if you know your attacker likes to split his nuke up along the train - you need more D.
If the attacker uses D trains to land after a few nukes - you need more D to land on the weakest parts of the train. Etc.
Now, this is important:
1) RUN THE DAMN SNIPING SCRIPT FIRST. Enter the date/time/co-ordinates, and it will give you a list like this:
If it helps, delete all the (0) commands. Then, you have to work out your own lag and the train.
So let's say a train lands like this:
12:00:00:400
12:00:00:500
12:00:00:600
12:00:00:700
That is what I like to call the last half of the second. Now I know that my computer has about 200-300 ms lag (you get this by doing test runs and by checking what it's "generated" in at the bottom. You need to get a feel for this. It doesn't matter what account you are on. It's dependent on YOUR net and YOUR computer. So work it out and keep checking it.)
Now I know that if I send just before the second I'm supposed to send at, it will probably land at like:
12:00:00:200
So I try and wait roughly a fifth of a second to send (it takes practice, but you'll get used to it if you do it often enough).
Also - split it up into packets and use opera. So if I have to send 4000 spears, I will make two packets of 2k spears and start sending a little bit early, to see if I can just cut at the right time. Then label your snipes and misses and cancel the misses immediately. There you go, problem solved. You don't need to try and snipe with one attempt with 9k swords at once. YOU CAN SPLIT IT UP INTO PACKETS AND YOU CAN HAVE LIKE 9 SNIPE ATTEMPTS FROM ONE VILLAGE.
That deals with one type of sniping.
The other type of sniping is cancel sniping - this is for using troops in a village already to snipe with.
Now let's say, you have 12 minutes to go till a noble lands and 5k swords sitting in a village. Do you just wait around? No. You send them to a nearby barb, repeatedly, until you get the MS you want. By this I mean the following:
I've got an attack landing in 12 minutes. What I then do for 30 seconds is keep sending out and cancelling attacks until I get the millisecond that I want - so if I want to cut the 3rd noble, for instance, I'd want the 600 ms at the end. So I'd keep sending until I got an attack that landed at or around there.
Then, I wait half the time and cancel it. So if I did at 11 minutes, I'd wait 5.5 minutes and cancel it. It has to be exact, so you have to know when to cancel and you have to factor in your own lag.
Returning troops from a cancel snipe return on the ms that they were sent out at. Just send an attack at a nearby barb, check the ms, and cancel it, and see the last 3 small numbers in grey.
Obviously cancel snipes work up to a maximum of 20 minutes away for a noble attack.
If you have no other choice, snipe with O. Try not to use a full nuke (these could be used for clever recaps instead) - but if necessary throw like 500-1k LC in between nobles to annoy them.
And finally with sniping, other then cancel sniping (where you generally get a few goes - you could set up like 3 tries of 1k swords each or something at different intervals) - you'll usually get loads and loads of attempts at sniping IF YOU DO IT EARLY ENOUGH AND DO NOT PANIC. It's always best to snipe with as much as you can reasonably use (If you have 12 trains to one area, don't use all the D to snipe one village. Be smart with it!)
That's pretty much it for now, I'll be adding more. Any questions/comments, post em below.
Greg
Edited by Gregoun on 13.08. at 00:38[/spoil]
Here is your response:
[spoil]binks-sake on 13.08.2011 at 11:49Quote Edit Delete
Thanks Gregoun for the post.
I would try to practice the art of sniping. I learned some stuff from the post.
Gregoun wrote:
this will involve sniping. Anyone who does know how to snipe at this stage is just plain....argh!
BTW people know that i do not have the art of sniping. I understand the concept and can run the script, but trimming the snipe to that exact time is something i did not practiced. SO I might just be pain....argh! but i normally take those sits that are not front-line.[/spoil]
Oooooh boy, there's a lot to say here;
1) You didn't just mention that you can't snipe. You flat out refused to take sits. You mentioned several times in our group chat when we asked for sitters that you couldn't do it.
Posted by you:
"I would say i am also in the people who are not participating in helping the tribe, but normally i do not sit people. When i lead HY i hardly sit for members. If it is a real emergency i used to take the sit and pass it on to someone online. Same is the situation here, I would try to help the tribe."
2) There's a difference between suggestion and flat out interference and over-stepping your boundaries. It is true; you don't know what's right. You don't know where the line is.
Oh boy.....
[spoil]Side 1:
Players: binks-sake
Side 2:
Tribes: S-D
Timeframe: Forever
Total conquers against opposite side:
Side 1: 104
Side 2: 8
Difference: 96
Points value of total conquers against opposite side:
Side 1: 987,022
Side 2: 76,702
Difference: 910,320
[/spoil]
I'd just like to point this out again:
When Xsha's account left S-D, and he rated himself 10/10 for selflessness and he ONLY put himself with those guys to show how rare he is, he left with the following:
S-D CODE 04th September 2011 - 12:06:06 1,324,981
From the start of him taking the account:
"01/08 - (347K – 39villages) - I take control of Binks-sake."
During the war, Binks-sake's account made 102 conquers totalling a whopping:
Side 1: 853,935
How many of that were conquers on S-D players or people associated with us/leavers;
About 60.
About 550-560k of that was on internals alone.
The other 40 conquers were not war conquers.
Out of a 102 total internals, about 60 of them were due to Xsha during the time that he was IN S-D. That's selflessness right there!
How much of that was Xsha? About 600k ish. Ahh, but then the other growth must have come from Haul, right?
His war stats:
binks-sake [no longer in the tribe] 0 0 0 128.638 571.711
Maybe against Code, you say?
binks-sake [no longer in the tribe] 0 1 -1 0 254.526
Basically, during the month or so that Xsha claims he was on the account, he didn't really participate in the war. He did, to some extent, but remember, he's 10/10 for selflessness!!!!!!!!!!!! Clearly, 55/60 internals out of a 100 or so villages during the one month you are on and not helping with caps against the enemy is exactly what selfless people do!
Even Toasty and others complained about your letter. I know for a fact that Trill and Toasty (and I) made jokes about how foolish your suggestion letter was. You mentioned it was a suggestion, but it a was a suggestion that wasted everyone's time:
A) MoM would have to pick up a weaker tribe and merge with them and take on several new wars.
B) MoM would have to merge with a tribe that wanted to war them and that they suspected of helping Mohua....
Etc, Need I go on? The merge idea was poorly thought out.
Just like that merge idea you proposed to Ohyeah; and Baron made it clear that he wouldn't merge us, yet you blamed that on a lack of leadership on me for splitting up S-D, when it was made clear that none of the tribes around us (not just Ohyeah) would not take us wholemeal. And why should they? We were a sinking ship. No reason to recruit a large bunch of players that have already failed as a team.
As you point in your reply - you regularly made suggestions. Part of those suggestions were issues with inactivity - I can dig them up if you want. But a lot of players from many different tribes can vouch for you giving them info - such as info about which accounts were sat/which were not. Probably inadvertently while trying to defend S-D in speech, you may dropped something like; "But account X is being sat at the moment, so it's not a fair comparison for war stats". - I have skype logs of the people who took intel from you. My best guess? You did it without realising. I'd go through and check all your own skype logs.
As for part 2, let's see;
You repeatedly raised issues about my leadership. Before that Toasty's leadership. You commented on the selfishness of people; you judged them, etc, when you yourself were no better. And the externals are rife with your judgements on the perceived failings of others; just read some of your recent posts in the W56 forums. I can quote them, but I have a suspect feeling that you know what I'm talking about.
Let's clear up this messy sequence of events;
1) Original Oldmanhutch quits a few days before you guys leave for Code.
2) We find a new owner for the account, but Nick the strong is sitting it most of the time while the new owner familiarizes themselves with the account. Nick was quite happy playing it as a side account, just like he did on Toasty for awhile.
3) We hear that there is an op being planned on 12 and Elwee - both of which are denied by Subzy and a few others. Turns out they are true.
4) You then proceed to plan an op on Oldman - an account that appears inactive.
5) I let on in S-D that Elwee/12/Oldman are next op targets. Elwee isn't worried as he is moving accounts; 12 isn't worried because he doesn't care, and the new player on Oldman just gives up because he didn't want to face an incoming op with basically no troops (the oldman account was constantly under fire, as you know.)
6) Nick then starts to proceed to internal and we just let the account go - at which point, you and I have our conversation.
It is a betrayal because you planned an op on an S-D account after internalling 600K+ points and doing next to nothing in a war that others spent literally 24/7 fighting. It's a betrayal to take so much from a tribe, who were trying to help you out, to then plan an op on account (inactive or active, it makes no difference) and kick a dog when it's down, so to speak. You knew that every village lost for S-D was more gained for our enemies which made our positions worse.
As for you telling people that 12 was active; it made no difference. They still went ahead and tried to hit him, so he hit back.
As you pointed out two quotes above; you attacked an inactive which you thought you could attack because it was inactive and you didn't consider that a betrayal. So, first off, how is it not fair for 12 to do the EXACT same thing?
Secondly; 12 was retaliating. He was being hit by Code and he had noble trains incoming. I know, I saw the account. A few Code guys used the inactive accounts to launch at him, and he hit back, harder then they expected.
Consider this me sharing my opinion.
You made several statements which turned out to be false;
How is that any different?
As for being good/etc; you can think of yourself as you wish. I make it pretty clear what I think of you.
If the answers to your questions aren't obvious now, then they will never be.
This is getting ridiculous, but I thought I'd open a thread where you can proceed to post any follow-up questions you may have. I have already proved that you have lied, in the above example about the guides, and proving it again with different examples isn't going to be difficult.
I bet there's going to be another spout of sacramental and self-appreciative posting soon about how rare and good of a player you are.
I'm getting really tired of this, but I was prodded by a few people asking questions to start sharing, so I am.
Regardless of what you are like as a player (you could be as graceful and penitent and controlled as the perfect man for all that I care);
And I want to make this next bit very clear;
In-game, you did hardly anything for your tribe. For me, actions speak louder then words ever will. And the actions of you say not much more then a freeloader (albeit with a good heart) and a misplaced moral compass which affects their ability to work well as a cohesive unit and actually participate in-game as part of the team, reducing (but not completely removing) any use that they serve in a game.
Let's go through Xsha's reply to mine:
[spoil]
[/spoil]
Fair enough. Nothing to dispute here.
Un-true. I have gone through all of our defense threads and skype chats - I see you sending D on maybe 5/6 occassions that were made public. A few others sent a lot more.
You keep alluding to the fact that Code declared and that Toasty stepped down; however, this does not change what happened. We carried out ops on Vesve with Ohyeah (and other local players), and we kept pushing forward. If you had read a lot of our shared forum, we had several "mini-ops" running.
Also, after Toasty left and a few others left with him, we didn't have the manpower for a large op. People were fighting tooth and nail because some people didn't send D and some people didn't sit and too many were "inactive" (ie logging in once every two days and doing pretty much nothing - but still being online every so often.) We ran mini-ops and I have multiple skype chats to prove it. Plus if you analyse our conquer history, you'll notice where the ops crop up. Check for instance correlation between myself/Knightofthespirit/Angel and Ohyeah players in K53. You'll find a few common targets/roughly same landing times. Also, we asked for nukes hundreds of times to help clear targets - did you send? The answer is no.
Right,
Part 1) If people are wrong, they inadvertently mention it, especially as a slip of the tongue or by accident. Otherwise, how would we ever know that someone is wrong, if they didn't act on it or talk about it? We can't read minds. Yet.
As for the guides, here is example number one, in which you actually WROTE A RESPONSE.
*****PLEASE NOTE THE DATE; it is one of several guides******
[spoil]Gregoun on 13.08.2011 at 00:18Quote Edit
THIS IS A LONG BUT NECESSARY POST ABOUT DEFENDING AND SITTING. It should help some players.
Guys, this is becoming a slowly worse and worse situation. We've got so many people on vacation, the rest of us need to help out with sitting. Yes, this will involve sniping. Anyone who does know how to snipe at this stage is just plain....argh!
Even in the worst of times; a little bit of thinking and not being scared can help. The worst thing to do on this, and indeed any war game, is panic.
I'm gonna go through how things should go for defending an account:
If you get a sit, especially one with loads of untagged incomings; the one thing you cannot do is panic and go "Meh, I'll just leave it, it's not my account" - because it will be your account next.
You're all going to have to become comfortable with sniping. Because, if you don't try snipes, the account owner will end up losing anyway. A try and failed snipe is better then sitting for 6 hours going "Can anyone sit and snipe please? It's urgent" and losing 15 villages in that. The more you try, the more confident you get. No-one makes every single snipe. You will lose villages, you will have to get used to that.
A few things about teamwork:
People need to recap villages which are going to be a dead loss and are just a drain to defend. Sometimes, it's easier to let a village go then to stack or snipe it. Most of our enemies don't bother sending D to land after the noble (minus a few guys in Code, and two in Haul). Therefore, if all else fails, go for the recap!
WORK WITH THE PEOPLE IN YOUR AREA. IF YOU NEED D, ASK THEM. If they can't give it, go for the recap. But for god's sakes, don't be the strong and silent type.
Right, things to do for a sit, especially a FRONTLINE sit:
Things to do if you're passing off a sit:
Right, time for a bit of work on sniping:
SNIPING IS EASY. There's nothing to be afraid of.
First things first, figure out what you know about the attacker. Chat to team mates, see how they like to send. Every attacker has a pattern. I have one, we all have one. We like our set routines that make us succesful - hardly anyone ever changes it up. Humans are predictable end of.
For instance, if you know your attacker likes to split his nuke up along the train - you need more D.
If the attacker uses D trains to land after a few nukes - you need more D to land on the weakest parts of the train. Etc.
Now, this is important:
1) RUN THE DAMN SNIPING SCRIPT FIRST. Enter the date/time/co-ordinates, and it will give you a list like this:
If it helps, delete all the (0) commands. Then, you have to work out your own lag and the train.
So let's say a train lands like this:
12:00:00:400
12:00:00:500
12:00:00:600
12:00:00:700
That is what I like to call the last half of the second. Now I know that my computer has about 200-300 ms lag (you get this by doing test runs and by checking what it's "generated" in at the bottom. You need to get a feel for this. It doesn't matter what account you are on. It's dependent on YOUR net and YOUR computer. So work it out and keep checking it.)
Now I know that if I send just before the second I'm supposed to send at, it will probably land at like:
12:00:00:200
So I try and wait roughly a fifth of a second to send (it takes practice, but you'll get used to it if you do it often enough).
Also - split it up into packets and use opera. So if I have to send 4000 spears, I will make two packets of 2k spears and start sending a little bit early, to see if I can just cut at the right time. Then label your snipes and misses and cancel the misses immediately. There you go, problem solved. You don't need to try and snipe with one attempt with 9k swords at once. YOU CAN SPLIT IT UP INTO PACKETS AND YOU CAN HAVE LIKE 9 SNIPE ATTEMPTS FROM ONE VILLAGE.
That deals with one type of sniping.
The other type of sniping is cancel sniping - this is for using troops in a village already to snipe with.
Now let's say, you have 12 minutes to go till a noble lands and 5k swords sitting in a village. Do you just wait around? No. You send them to a nearby barb, repeatedly, until you get the MS you want. By this I mean the following:
I've got an attack landing in 12 minutes. What I then do for 30 seconds is keep sending out and cancelling attacks until I get the millisecond that I want - so if I want to cut the 3rd noble, for instance, I'd want the 600 ms at the end. So I'd keep sending until I got an attack that landed at or around there.
Then, I wait half the time and cancel it. So if I did at 11 minutes, I'd wait 5.5 minutes and cancel it. It has to be exact, so you have to know when to cancel and you have to factor in your own lag.
Returning troops from a cancel snipe return on the ms that they were sent out at. Just send an attack at a nearby barb, check the ms, and cancel it, and see the last 3 small numbers in grey.
Obviously cancel snipes work up to a maximum of 20 minutes away for a noble attack.
If you have no other choice, snipe with O. Try not to use a full nuke (these could be used for clever recaps instead) - but if necessary throw like 500-1k LC in between nobles to annoy them.
And finally with sniping, other then cancel sniping (where you generally get a few goes - you could set up like 3 tries of 1k swords each or something at different intervals) - you'll usually get loads and loads of attempts at sniping IF YOU DO IT EARLY ENOUGH AND DO NOT PANIC. It's always best to snipe with as much as you can reasonably use (If you have 12 trains to one area, don't use all the D to snipe one village. Be smart with it!)
That's pretty much it for now, I'll be adding more. Any questions/comments, post em below.
Greg
Edited by Gregoun on 13.08. at 00:38[/spoil]
Here is your response:
[spoil]binks-sake on 13.08.2011 at 11:49Quote Edit Delete
Thanks Gregoun for the post.
I would try to practice the art of sniping. I learned some stuff from the post.
Gregoun wrote:
this will involve sniping. Anyone who does know how to snipe at this stage is just plain....argh!
BTW people know that i do not have the art of sniping. I understand the concept and can run the script, but trimming the snipe to that exact time is something i did not practiced. SO I might just be pain....argh! but i normally take those sits that are not front-line.[/spoil]
Oooooh boy, there's a lot to say here;
1) You didn't just mention that you can't snipe. You flat out refused to take sits. You mentioned several times in our group chat when we asked for sitters that you couldn't do it.
Posted by you:
"I would say i am also in the people who are not participating in helping the tribe, but normally i do not sit people. When i lead HY i hardly sit for members. If it is a real emergency i used to take the sit and pass it on to someone online. Same is the situation here, I would try to help the tribe."
2) There's a difference between suggestion and flat out interference and over-stepping your boundaries. It is true; you don't know what's right. You don't know where the line is.
Oh boy.....
[spoil]Side 1:
Players: binks-sake
Side 2:
Tribes: S-D
Timeframe: Forever
Total conquers against opposite side:
Side 1: 104
Side 2: 8
Difference: 96
Points value of total conquers against opposite side:
Side 1: 987,022
Side 2: 76,702
Difference: 910,320
I'd just like to point this out again:
When Xsha's account left S-D, and he rated himself 10/10 for selflessness and he ONLY put himself with those guys to show how rare he is, he left with the following:
S-D CODE 04th September 2011 - 12:06:06 1,324,981
From the start of him taking the account:
"01/08 - (347K – 39villages) - I take control of Binks-sake."
During the war, Binks-sake's account made 102 conquers totalling a whopping:
Side 1: 853,935
How many of that were conquers on S-D players or people associated with us/leavers;
About 60.
About 550-560k of that was on internals alone.
The other 40 conquers were not war conquers.
Out of a 102 total internals, about 60 of them were due to Xsha during the time that he was IN S-D. That's selflessness right there!
How much of that was Xsha? About 600k ish. Ahh, but then the other growth must have come from Haul, right?
His war stats:
binks-sake [no longer in the tribe] 0 0 0 128.638 571.711
Maybe against Code, you say?
binks-sake [no longer in the tribe] 0 1 -1 0 254.526
Basically, during the month or so that Xsha claims he was on the account, he didn't really participate in the war. He did, to some extent, but remember, he's 10/10 for selflessness!!!!!!!!!!!! Clearly, 55/60 internals out of a 100 or so villages during the one month you are on and not helping with caps against the enemy is exactly what selfless people do!
Even Toasty and others complained about your letter. I know for a fact that Trill and Toasty (and I) made jokes about how foolish your suggestion letter was. You mentioned it was a suggestion, but it a was a suggestion that wasted everyone's time:
A) MoM would have to pick up a weaker tribe and merge with them and take on several new wars.
B) MoM would have to merge with a tribe that wanted to war them and that they suspected of helping Mohua....
Etc, Need I go on? The merge idea was poorly thought out.
Just like that merge idea you proposed to Ohyeah; and Baron made it clear that he wouldn't merge us, yet you blamed that on a lack of leadership on me for splitting up S-D, when it was made clear that none of the tribes around us (not just Ohyeah) would not take us wholemeal. And why should they? We were a sinking ship. No reason to recruit a large bunch of players that have already failed as a team.
As you point in your reply - you regularly made suggestions. Part of those suggestions were issues with inactivity - I can dig them up if you want. But a lot of players from many different tribes can vouch for you giving them info - such as info about which accounts were sat/which were not. Probably inadvertently while trying to defend S-D in speech, you may dropped something like; "But account X is being sat at the moment, so it's not a fair comparison for war stats". - I have skype logs of the people who took intel from you. My best guess? You did it without realising. I'd go through and check all your own skype logs.
As for part 2, let's see;
You repeatedly raised issues about my leadership. Before that Toasty's leadership. You commented on the selfishness of people; you judged them, etc, when you yourself were no better. And the externals are rife with your judgements on the perceived failings of others; just read some of your recent posts in the W56 forums. I can quote them, but I have a suspect feeling that you know what I'm talking about.
Let's clear up this messy sequence of events;
1) Original Oldmanhutch quits a few days before you guys leave for Code.
2) We find a new owner for the account, but Nick the strong is sitting it most of the time while the new owner familiarizes themselves with the account. Nick was quite happy playing it as a side account, just like he did on Toasty for awhile.
3) We hear that there is an op being planned on 12 and Elwee - both of which are denied by Subzy and a few others. Turns out they are true.
4) You then proceed to plan an op on Oldman - an account that appears inactive.
5) I let on in S-D that Elwee/12/Oldman are next op targets. Elwee isn't worried as he is moving accounts; 12 isn't worried because he doesn't care, and the new player on Oldman just gives up because he didn't want to face an incoming op with basically no troops (the oldman account was constantly under fire, as you know.)
6) Nick then starts to proceed to internal and we just let the account go - at which point, you and I have our conversation.
It is a betrayal because you planned an op on an S-D account after internalling 600K+ points and doing next to nothing in a war that others spent literally 24/7 fighting. It's a betrayal to take so much from a tribe, who were trying to help you out, to then plan an op on account (inactive or active, it makes no difference) and kick a dog when it's down, so to speak. You knew that every village lost for S-D was more gained for our enemies which made our positions worse.
As for you telling people that 12 was active; it made no difference. They still went ahead and tried to hit him, so he hit back.
As you pointed out two quotes above; you attacked an inactive which you thought you could attack because it was inactive and you didn't consider that a betrayal. So, first off, how is it not fair for 12 to do the EXACT same thing?
Secondly; 12 was retaliating. He was being hit by Code and he had noble trains incoming. I know, I saw the account. A few Code guys used the inactive accounts to launch at him, and he hit back, harder then they expected.
So you did attack him? :icon_confused:
Consider this me sharing my opinion.
I didn't come up with an excuse; I came up with a reason. Just like you saying that you didn't attack Toasty; but Anthony did. I didn't want to leave Tutti, my co did. Then I went to S-D, and like you, I am loyal to one tribe. If you are in the wrong, then so am I. Then we both made excuses and we should be collectively held responsible for the actions of our accounts (which, actually, I do ultimately believe.... It's just fun arguing other angles with you.)
You made several statements which turned out to be false;
How is that any different?
As for being good/etc; you can think of yourself as you wish. I make it pretty clear what I think of you.
If the answers to your questions aren't obvious now, then they will never be.
This is getting ridiculous, but I thought I'd open a thread where you can proceed to post any follow-up questions you may have. I have already proved that you have lied, in the above example about the guides, and proving it again with different examples isn't going to be difficult.
I bet there's going to be another spout of sacramental and self-appreciative posting soon about how rare and good of a player you are.
I'm getting really tired of this, but I was prodded by a few people asking questions to start sharing, so I am.
Regardless of what you are like as a player (you could be as graceful and penitent and controlled as the perfect man for all that I care);
And I want to make this next bit very clear;
In-game, you did hardly anything for your tribe. For me, actions speak louder then words ever will. And the actions of you say not much more then a freeloader (albeit with a good heart) and a misplaced moral compass which affects their ability to work well as a cohesive unit and actually participate in-game as part of the team, reducing (but not completely removing) any use that they serve in a game.
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