Just curious what does mean "Max noble distance = 100"?

DeletedUser

Guest
haha i make my HQ 23 to follow the special 9,999 pt village. But other than that my village is standard.


Thanks,

For some reason it decided that my edits needed a brand new post. Has no one else been playing and seen endless offers of clay for wood/iron?

I admit dropping my clay mines to 28 in all villages was probably a bit extreme and I wouldn't do it again, but I always managed to trade for whatever clay I needed.

I agree. In late game, there are wayyy to much clay on the market.
 
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spleen mage

Guest
Also, spleen mage, I love it when people target my academies. Either it is a minor 6 hour rebuild or I just transport the resources elsewhere to buid coins. Either way you've not really hurt me with your catapults.

That's the point, if you don't have 20 smithy, it has hurt you :icon_wink: It's either a 50+ rebuild time, for all the smithys + academy, or wasting valuable time transporting resource, which can take bucket loads of time if you're doing it in multiple villages. And if you have a big market place to do so efficently, then that's counter-productive to your whole "increasing farm space" scheme anyway :icon_wink:

Oh, and whoever says archers are bad is a fool. When you have people who refuse to build MA because they "suck", then they get slaughtered by archers. Period. Since archers have better stats (even if they do cost more) why not build them during periods of peace, when troops are not so desperately needed?
 
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Ripfin

Guest
That's the point, if you don't have 20 smithy, it has hurt you :icon_wink: It's either a 50+ rebuild time, for all the smithys + academy, or wasting valuable time transporting resource, which can take bucket loads of time if you're doing it in multiple villages. And if you have a big market place to do so efficently, then that's counter-productive to your whole "increasing farm space" scheme anyway :icon_wink:

Oh, and whoever says archers are bad is a fool. When you have people who refuse to build MA because they "suck", then they get slaughtered by archers. Period. Since archers have better stats (even if they do cost more) why not build them during periods of peace, when troops are not so desperately needed?


archers die easier then most units and i've faced thousands of them and they all died still, and I didn't use MA.
 

spleen mage

Guest
archers die easier then most units and i've faced thousands of them and they all died still, and I didn't use MA.

Ok, since we're going for the "excluding MA" argument.

Archers = 50 def vs. Axe, 40 vs. cav
Spear = 15 def vs. Axe, 45 vs. Cav

Bit of a no-brainer really.

Archers have the same def against axes as swords do, and have almost as good defense against LC as spears. If you opponent used no MA, then an army of pure archers would be your best bet.
 

Ripfin

Guest
Ok, since we're going for the "excluding MA" argument.

Archers = 50 def vs. Axe, 40 vs. cav
Spear = 15 def vs. Axe, 45 vs. Cav

Bit of a no-brainer really.

Archers have the same def against axes as swords do, and have almost as good defense against LC as spears. If you opponent used no MA, then an army of pure archers would be your best bet.

you still miss the point:

run this thru your simulator:

my attack:

7222 Axe
3000 LC
300 Rams

your defense:

20,000 archers
lvl 20 wall
no paladin or items
and no luck either way, then tell me how awesome your archers are.

then run my defense against my attack:

7722 Spear
8000 Sword
500 HC

which defense is better?
 

spleen mage

Guest
I think it's you who still misses the point.


Archers.


Attacker Units: 0 0 7222 0 0 3000 0 0 300 0 0 0
Losses: 0 0 7222 0 0 3000 0 0 300 0 0 0

Defender Units: 0 0 0 20000 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Losses: 0 0 0 6765 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Damage by rams: The wall has been damaged and downgraded from level 20 to level 18


Losses - 6765 farm spaces.

Sw/Sp


Attacker Units: 0 0 7222 0 0 3000 0 0 300 0 0 0
Losses: 0 0 7222 0 0 3000 0 0 300 0 0 0

Defender Units: 10000 10000 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Losses: 5637 5637 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Damage by rams: The wall has been damaged and downgraded from level 20 to level 16

- Losses, 11275 farm spaces.






Edit: Your defense is even worse.

Attacker Units: 0 0 7222 0 0 3000 0 0 300 0 0 0
Losses: 0 0 7222 0 0 3000 0 0 300 0 0 0

Defender Units: 7722 8000 0 0 0 0 0 500 0 0 0 0
Losses: 5246 5435 0 0 0 0 0 340 0 0 0 0
Damage by rams: The wall has been damaged and downgraded from level 20 to level 15

Losses: 12,721 farm spaces.

Now try telling me that even without Mounted Archers, that Archers are useless.
 
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Ripfin

Guest
oops ran the archers as axes.

but what it comes down to is pretty much 2 attacks will wipe out both defenses (provided the village can even build 20K Archers), so meanwhile while my defense builds faster and cheaper yours takes forever to rebuild.
 
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spleen mage

Guest
oops ran the archers as axes.

but what it comes down to is pretty much 2 attacks will wipe out both defenses (provided the village can even build 20K Archers), so meanwhile while my defense builds faster and cheaper yours takes forever to rebuild.

- Your losses are about the same, cost wise, since you lose more.

- With archers, your wall is lowered less. That is vital for bringing in more support.

- You're not even taking into consideration stacking, only one village. Now imagine either 5 of your D villages, then 5 archer ones. The difference is immense.

- The archers will kill 2 full nukes, and some of a third. Not only will 10k/10k (which is better then your defense anyway) not stand a second nuke, it will also not even kill a noble sent with the second nuke. Again, a crucial difference.

- I wouldn't advise building them if you need troops fast. But again, if you're in peace time, why not? Anyway, I would not simply build archers, unless I knew my opponent did not use MA.

- When you're sitting around for a long period of time, and spare res only goes towards coins anyway, cost is not really an issue - it's much more important to have an efficent defense.
 

Ripfin

Guest
- Your losses are about the same, cost wise, since you lose more.

- With archers, your wall is lowered less. That is vital for bringing in more support.

- You're not even taking into consideration stacking, only one village. Now imagine either 5 of your D villages, then 5 archer ones. The difference is immense.

- The archers will kill 2 full nukes, and some of a third. Not only will 10k/10k (which is better then your defense anyway) not stand a second nuke, it will also not even kill a noble sent with the second nuke. Again, a crucial difference.

- I wouldn't advise building them if you need troops fast. But again, if you're in peace time, why not? Anyway, I would not simply build archers, unless I knew my opponent did not use MA.

- When you're sitting around for a long period of time, and spare res only goes towards coins anyway, cost is not really an issue - it's much more important to have an efficent defense.


problem is MA are for destroying Archers specifically, if I came accross someone with an all archer defense like 20K archers i'd have someone I know send 3K MA at your village and destroy all of those archers.

end of story meanwhile i've got a better general defense which prevents people from launching all MA at me, or anything specific, it would have to be a mix village offense to do any damage.
 

spleen mage

Guest
problem is MA are for destroying Archers specifically, if I came accross someone with an all archer defense like 20K archers i'd have someone I know send 3K MA at your village and destroy all of those archers.

end of story meanwhile i've got a better general defense which prevents people from launching all MA at me, or anything specific, it would have to be a mix village offense to do any damage.

So.......

you act like people use archers? to be honest I find Archers and MA's to be a waste of time, their bland and overall have lousy defenses.

Are you admitting your original post was wrong?

- I just proved archers do not have a "lousy" defense.

- You just stated yourself that you'd need to use MA to kill them. Therefore, they're not useless.
 

Ripfin

Guest
So.......



Are you admitting your original post was wrong?

- I just proved archers do not have a "lousy" defense.

- You just stated yourself that you'd need to use MA to kill them. Therefore, they're not useless.


yes but when only 3K of 1 unit type can destroy 20K of another unit type behind a lvl 20 wall what does that tell you?
 

ramz fan

Guest
And ram fan? Why waste space on a lvl 20 smithy in a village you have more than enough villages to build nobles for you?

I'll leave out the rest of your mindless garbage because I frankly don't have the time or the incentive to fix a broken record. But I will reply to what your aiming at me.

Why have a lvl 20 smithy? Idk, there is this thing called an acedemy. You should build one. With one you can make a nobleman. They come in handy when you need to make an emergency nobleman or maybe to STORE COINS/PACKETS. It sure beats using your market to send your resources around to villages that actually do have academies.
 

ramz fan

Guest
yes but when only 3K of 1 unit type can destroy 20K of another unit type behind a lvl 20 wall what does that tell you?

Ripfin is right. And Spleen Mage is right.

Well your both right. But wrong. The best defense is always also the most versatile. Technically if the offense is cav heavy, a sword/archer defense is bad. If the offense is axe heavy, a sword/archer defense is key. If the offense is MA heavy, a 10ksp/sw is good. The best defense has to be versatile and cover all edges.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
I think it's you who still misses the point.


Archers.


Attacker Units: 0 0 7222 0 0 3000 0 0 300 0 0 0
Losses: 0 0 7222 0 0 3000 0 0 300 0 0 0

Defender Units: 0 0 0 20000 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Losses: 0 0 0 6765 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Damage by rams: The wall has been damaged and downgraded from level 20 to level 18


Losses - 6765 farm spaces.

Sw/Sp


Attacker Units: 0 0 7222 0 0 3000 0 0 300 0 0 0
Losses: 0 0 7222 0 0 3000 0 0 300 0 0 0

Defender Units: 10000 10000 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Losses: 5637 5637 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Damage by rams: The wall has been damaged and downgraded from level 20 to level 16

- Losses, 11275 farm spaces.






Edit: Your defense is even worse.

Attacker Units: 0 0 7222 0 0 3000 0 0 300 0 0 0
Losses: 0 0 7222 0 0 3000 0 0 300 0 0 0

Defender Units: 7722 8000 0 0 0 0 0 500 0 0 0 0
Losses: 5246 5435 0 0 0 0 0 340 0 0 0 0
Damage by rams: The wall has been damaged and downgraded from level 20 to level 15

Losses: 12,721 farm spaces.

Now try telling me that even without Mounted Archers, that Archers are useless.

They are useless.
You forgot calculate cost of 20 000 archers:
:wood: 2 000 000
:clay: 600 000
:iron: 1 200 000
time to build: 64 d 19 h 33 m 20 s

10 000 spears + 10 000 swords:
:wood:1 600 000
:clay:1 200 000
:iron:1 600 000
time to build: 45 d 8 h 53 m 20 s

As you can see spears and swords costs less 400 000 resources and time to build 10ksp/10ksw is 30% less than 20k archers :lol::lol::lol:

Please do not post more these simulations which have nothing relevant to the game. :lightcavalry:
Ok, since we're going for the "excluding MA" argument.

Archers = 50 def vs. Axe, 40 vs. cav
Spear = 15 def vs. Axe, 45 vs. Cav

Bit of a no-brainer really.

Archers have the same def against axes as swords do, and have almost as good defense against LC as spears. If you opponent used no MA, then an army of pure archers would be your best bet.
Actually you do not know anything about battle system. Nobody knows exactly how it works but game experience + rally poit simulations shows us that the best versatile defence is 10 000 swords + 10 000 archers and the best nuke is 4700 LC + 300 rams. But such defence and such nuke are unreal to build in every village!

I still can not realize do you guys kidding or do you really ask questions?
 
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spleen mage

Guest
Please, rookie, stop making a fool out of yourself, and actually read what I wrote, unless you want to continue making yourself look stupid.

They are useless.
You forgot calculate cost of 20 000 archers:
:wood: 2 000 000
:clay: 600 000
:iron: 1 200 000
time to build: 64 d 19 h 33 m 20 s

10 000 spears + 10 000 swords:
:wood:1 600 000
:clay:1 200 000
:iron:1 600 000
time to build: 45 d 8 h 53 m 20 s

As you can see spears and swords costs less 400 000 resources and time to build 10ksp/10ksw is 30% less than 20k archers :lol::lol::lol:

Losses for 10k/10k, from single Nuke.

450.960 338.220 450.960

Losses for 20k archers from Single Nuke.

676.500 202.950 405.900

So what, overall, you're losing only an extra 40k of resources, yet you're saving 5000 troops/farm spaces. Now try and come up with a convincing argument that it's not worth the extra cost. Especially at later stages where you can afford to have troops queued 24/7, no matter what they are.

Yes, I know Archers take longer to build. Firstly, if you'd actually learned to read (which evidently you haven't) I said that while they may not be great to build during times of war, during peace time when your troops are sitting around for a long time doing nothing, there is absolutely no reason not to build Archers. And since you lose less troops anyway, then your secondary rebuild time is much less, since you actually have troops left over.

Secondly, the 20k of Archers was an example; simply to prove that Archers do not have worse stats. I would never use Archers by themslves (simply because of the players, who unlike you, are actually clever enough to realise the usefulness of having MA), I'd use them in conjunction with other troops. If you'd read the previous conversation (again, you seem to be lacking in the paying attention department) you would have realised we were talking about the Scenario of fighting someone who does not use Mounted Archers. You have failed to come up with any convincing argument for why archers are not valuable in that situation.



Please do not post more these simulations which have nothing relevant to the game.

Um, what?

Actually you do not know anything about battle system.

Nobody knows exactly how it works but game experience

Ahh, I forgot that I'd had no game experience. My bad.

+ rally poit simulations shows us that the best versatile defence is 10 000 swords + 10 000 archers and the best nuke is 4700 LC + 300 rams. But such defence and such nuke are unreal to build in every village!

I never said anything about just building 20,000 archers. Again, that was an example to prove they had better stats then Sw/Sp. :icon_rolleyes:


I still can not realize do you guys kidding or do you really ask questions?

I'l just pretend that made sense.


Ripfin is right. And Spleen Mage is right.

Well your both right. But wrong. The best defense is always also the most versatile. Technically if the offense is cav heavy, a sword/archer defense is bad. If the offense is axe heavy, a sword/archer defense is key. If the offense is MA heavy, a 10ksp/sw is good. The best defense has to be versatile and cover all edges.

Exactly! My post may not have been clear, but I wasn't trying to advocate simply building 20k of archers; rather, keeping an "all rounder" kind of defense. I was just trying to prove Archers do not have worthless stats, and if people (like Ripfin) refuse to use MA, then they are undoubtably worth including in your army.
 
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DeletedUser

Guest
Why have a lvl 20 smithy? Idk, there is this thing called an acedemy. You should build one. With one you can make a nobleman.

Yes, because obviously with 100+ villages I haven't got any academies and don't know how to make noble :icon_rolleyes: Reading comprehension ftw! Did you not see everytime I talk about the late game, when a player has a lot of villages?

You drop the smithy from lvl20 to lvl15 in the late game in villages where you don't plan to build nobles and you are only using the academy that is already THERE to build coins. If it is destroyed by catapults it is no big loss.
 
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DeletedUser

Guest
spleen mage still can not realize that 20 000 archers might exist in theory only :)

I have said above that the best versatile defence is 10 000 swords + 10 000 archers, and the best nuke is pure LC nuke but nobody builds such amount of elite troops ever. Nothing to argue against that.

Village build-up also has been discussed ages ago zillion times. Why you all discuss about things which should be discussed in "Beginner's guide" section? I asked about something more important.

I asked about new feautures and new settings which should influe on whole w30 gameplay!

Beginners go to


and do not post here your newbie guides more plix pl0x.
 
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spleen mage

Guest
spleen mage still can not realize that 20 000 archers might exist in theory only :)

Learn to read.

Did you ignore my last post entirely? Or do you just have a sub-70 I.Q? I said repeatedly that I *WOULD NOT ADVISE JUST BUILDING 20k OF ARCHERS*, rather use Archers with other troops. I said that more then once.

Jesus christ, the trolls on new worlds get stupider and stupider.
 
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DeletedUser

Guest
That was adressed not only to you.
You are boring with rally simulation 20 000 archers in defence. I have seen it many times before, It is ridicuouls try to simulate unreal amount of units in defended village :) I do not know where from you came here but I tryed politely explain that I created this thread for discussion about new feautures in w30 but not to discuss next newbie guide. I guess players in world 30 do not need to discuss rally point simulations and they are enough skilled to pass it. :)
 

ramz fan

Guest
Yes, because obviously with 100+ villages I haven't got any academies and don't know how to make noble :icon_rolleyes: Reading comprehension ftw! Did you not see everytime I talk about the late game, when a player has a lot of villages?

You drop the smithy from lvl20 to lvl15 in the late game in villages where you don't plan to build nobles and you are only using the academy that is already THERE to build coins. If it is destroyed by catapults it is no big loss.

May I please refer you back to this post?

!!!
 
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