Religious Debate

[DeletedUser]

I was thinking the same thing. :icon_razz:

:icon_redface:[spoil]

I'd say that religion was invented to control the population from destroying each other after the fall of the Roman Empire

In that one I was meant to put the Catholic church but seemed to have missed it out on accident,

Yet again you are wrong. http://www.davidmacd.com/catholic/timeline_of_catholic_church.htm

Well I do have a link to throw at you too,

http://www.allfaith.com/Religions/Noahide/cathorigin.html

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/In_what_year_did_the_Roman_Empire_finally_collapse

Some argue the split of the empire into two was the cause for the fall, as do I.

[/spoil]
yup, wrong you are.

Edit: i put spoilers in order for the post not to be that long

 

[DeletedUser]

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/In_what_year_did_the_Roman_Empire_finally_collapse

Some argue the split of the empire into two was the cause for the fall, as do I.

A cause, yes. One of many, in fact. The sole reason, no. If it were, then the Byzantine Empire would not have been successful either.

 

[DeletedUser71940]

If you look at the dates.. Theodosius had both decreed "De Fide Catolica, in Thessalonica, published in Constantinople, declaring Catholic Christianity as the state religion of the Roman Empire." in 380. And had split the Roman Empire into two 15 years later.

 

[DeletedUser]

That wasn't the reason for the split. Not at all. The Eastern Orthodox Church wasn't established for some time after the slipt of the Empire.

 

[DeletedUser71940]

So when the Eastern Orthodox Church was established fully and legally? If I remember correctly, Christianity was prosecuted and followers were inprisoned untill quiet some time after Jesus's death.

 

[DeletedUser]

If you look at the dates.. Theodosius had both decreed "De Fide Catolica, in Thessalonica, published in Constantinople, declaring Catholic Christianity as the state religion of the Roman Empire." in 380. And had split the Roman Empire into two 15 years later.

Which was before not after.
See. :lol:

 

[DeletedUser]

So when the Eastern Orthodox Church was established fully and legally, if I remember correctly, this religion was prosecuted and followers were inprisoned untill quiet some time after Jesus's death.

What?:icon_confused:

Pyker translate please.:icon_biggrin::lol:

 

[DeletedUser71940]

Which was before not after.
See. :lol:

Well if you are planning something major such as the split you would consider the posibilities of the civil unrest due to the differences in ideologies and such, so it was possibly one of his plans in order to ensure stability among his subjects.

 

[DeletedUser]

So when the Eastern Orthodox Church was established fully and legally, if I remember correctly, this religion was prosecuted and followers were inprisoned untill quiet some time after Jesus's death.

/fail

The Eastern Orthodox church wasn't established until well after the split of the Western and Eastern Empires. The Roman Catholic church was the first truly organized church established. Until then there were many, many different sects of Christianity and they taught very different things. It was th Council of Nicea that established Christianity as we know it today.

 

[DeletedUser]

/fail

The Eastern Orthodox church wasn't established until well after the split of the Western and Eastern Empires. The Roman Catholic church was the first truly organized church established. Until then there were many, many different sects of Christianity and they taught very different things. It was th Council of Nicea that established Christianity as we know it today.

:lol:

What i thought.

 

[DeletedUser71940]

As I might I forgot to add the little question mark in place of the comma.

 

[DeletedUser]

its okay i got your back proto

 

[DeletedUser]

keep in mind most of the stories in the bible among other religions find there origins in past religions, often polytheistic religion that have died off.

I do believe in god, or at least hope he is there. I don't have rituals, I don't believe I have to dedicate a whole day or month to show my believe. I believe that if there is a god he wouldn't interfere with our lives no matter how bad they got, because we deserve what we make. If anything he would want us to live, lives a father could be proud of. Above all there is no black and white in life, so I don't think he would lay down "commandments" to live by.

As far a noah's arc, I believe the truth behind that can be found in science. I dont think the story is true at all, maybe origionating off a farmer with a boat that managed to survive or claimed he survived. Based on science and the area's and origions of the people that came up with the myth it is generally accepted in scientific communities that the story came from the black sea's creation. The black sea used to be land, but at a low elevation, then the sea level rose and the area was flooded rapidly. Think of a small country sized tsunami that was just one big wave, rather then several large one's resulting in a rapid increase in sea level. This one just came in all at once.

Also another big flaw is science is that how could it rain that much on the earth? We know that the polar ice was bigger back then, then it is now. Where did all the water come from or where did it go?

As far as aliens, I believe in them. The world is to big for us to not have them, and we have substantial amount of evidence that they have at least visited earth. I watched a show called UFO hunters, and that really sparked my interest to look up more info on them. Unfortunately during the show they only came up with one very concrete piece of evidence, aside from the star child skull which had already been found. They found a super-conductor from an incident 15 years ago that we still can't make. I know they analyzed it, but they only pulled data based on it's make up and lack of electromagnetic field, but the surprise is that we cant duplicate it by a large technological margin. Some other evidence came up like people with objects in them recalling abductions, however when the implants were tested by the team it gave off AM radio signals, along with being assimilated with the persons body (ie; the body didn't reject it as a foreign object). When the object was removed it stopped transmiting it's signal, however based on tests on the object after wards no technology hinting towards alien life was found.

but on the religion aspect, I take anything written about how the world works that is more then 100 years old with a very large grain of salt (and sometimes tequila)

 

[DeletedUser]

As I might I forgot to add the little question mark in place of the comma.

Don't you mean a period instead of a question mark? :lol:

And, that is quite a major distinction. Instead of asking a question, as you intended, you made a statement. Big difference. :icon_wink:

keep in mind most of the stories in the bible among other religions find there origins in past religions, often polytheistic religion that have died off.

Gilgamesh, anyone? He was two parts divine and one part human. Sound familiar? If you are a Christian it should, since the Holy Trinity is two parts divine, and one part human.

As far a noah's arc, I believe the truth behind that can be found in science. I dont think the story is true at all, maybe origionating off a farmer with a boat that managed to survive or claimed he survived. Based on science and the area's and origions of the people that came up with the myth it is generally accepted in scientific communities that the story came from the black sea's creation. The black sea used to be land, but at a low elevation, then the sea level rose and the area was flooded rapidly. Think of a small country sized tsunami that was just one big wave, rather then several large one's resulting in a rapid increase in sea level. This one just came in all at once.

Considering that the Black Sea, which did exist, but in a much smaller form, during the last Ice Age, as we know it was formed by the rising seas due to the melting of the ice that covered a large percentage of the world, it isn't all that hard to figure out that the basis od this story is probably pretty true. Even today, something like 75% of the worlds population lives within 25 miles of a body of water, so it isn't hard to figure out what rising seas would have done to people, who at that time, lived mostly in coastal regions. When the coasts changed the world over, the believe of a world wide flood emerged.

Consider this, if it was just the Black Sea area involved, why, then, do cultures like the Mayans and Incas, in the Americas, have a flood tradition? How would they have found out about it?

Also another big flaw is science is that how could it rain that much on the earth? We know that the polar ice was bigger back then, then it is now. Where did all the water come from or where did it go?

As for what caused the flood and the rain, I can speculate on that. The melting ice is what raised the sea levels. Also, with ice melting over a large portion of the world, and with the rising temperatures, it is a pretty good bet that the amount of water evaporating into the air was at a much higher level than during the ice age, and probably since it's end. Maybe it wasn't 40 days and 40 nights, but it is likely to have resulted in more percipitation than had ever been seen before the whole world round.

 

[DeletedUser71940]

Don't you mean a period instead of a question mark? :lol:

And, that is quite a major distinction. Instead of asking a question, as you intended, you made a statement. Big difference. :icon_wink:

Yes, I have had a tiring week so made an awful lot of mistakes lately.

 

[DeletedUser]

Well I can see the sea level rising but in order to cause rain there would also have to be more air born molecules like carbon in order to accumulate the water molecules that cause rain. Granted that could go along with a couple major volcanic erruptions, but I haven't sourced any reliable information regarding that time period and volcanism. If the water levels rose then it could have the same effect on other parts of the world resulting in the stories. Or it could just be the imagination of man and our natural fears of fire and water that our societies have carried transferred into the religious works in order to cause more of an effect on the people in general.

 

[DeletedUser]

Well I can see the sea level rising but in order to cause rain there would also have to be more air born molecules like carbon in order to accumulate the water molecules that cause rain. Granted that could go along with a couple major volcanic erruptions, but I haven't sourced any reliable information regarding that time period and volcanism. If the water levels rose then it could have the same effect on other parts of the world resulting in the stories. Or it could just be the imagination of man and our natural fears of fire and water that our societies have carried transferred into the religious works in order to cause more of an effect on the people in general.

lol, it was more molecules of hydrogen2 oxygen that led to an increase in rainfall. :icon_wink:

As for volcanism, it is likely to have been a fairly active period for that since it is well known that the gases released by volcanoes are major causes of the greehouse effect, which is what led to the end of every Ice Age, including the one knwon as "Snowball Earth."

Were the flood story just isolated to a couple of cultures with known ties and contacts, it could be written off as imagination or just a good stroy. The fact that a similar story exists in most ancient cultures world wide, suggest that it is very likely a world wide event vividly remembered by humans.

 

[DeletedUser]

this is what I meant lol

Cloud condensation nuclei or CCNs (also known as cloud seeds) are small particles (typically 0.2 µm, or 1/100 th the size of a cloud droplet [1]) about which cloud droplets coalesce. Water requires a non-gaseous surface to make the transition from a vapour to a liquid. In the atmosphere, this surface presents itself as tiny solid or liquid particles called CCNs. When no CCNs are present, water vapour can be supercooled below 0 °C (32 °F) before droplets spontaneously form (this is the basis of the cloud chamber for detecting subatomic particles). In above freezing temperatures the air would have to be supersaturated to around 400% before the droplets could form. The concept of cloud condensation nuclei has led to the idea of cloud seeding, that tries to encourage rainfall by seeding the air with condensation nuclei.



Lots of volcanic activity supplies the atmosphere with plenty of condensation nuclei

 

[DeletedUser]

this is what I meant lol

Cloud condensation nuclei or CCNs (also known as cloud seeds) are small particles (typically 0.2 µm, or 1/100 th the size of a cloud droplet [1]) about which cloud droplets coalesce. Water requires a non-gaseous surface to make the transition from a vapour to a liquid. In the atmosphere, this surface presents itself as tiny solid or liquid particles called CCNs. When no CCNs are present, water vapour can be supercooled below 0 °C (32 °F) before droplets spontaneously form (this is the basis of the cloud chamber for detecting subatomic particles). In above freezing temperatures the air would have to be supersaturated to around 400% before the droplets could form. The concept of cloud condensation nuclei has led to the idea of cloud seeding, that tries to encourage rainfall by seeding the air with condensation nuclei.



Lots of volcanic activity supplies the atmosphere with plenty of condensation nuclei

Which also explains the rise in temperatures because of the greenhouse gases, which also helps melt the ice further compounding the situation.

In other words, you have supported my theory pretty nicely, thanks. :icon_wink:

 

[DeletedUser]

When one person suffers from a delusion it is called insanity. When many people suffer from a delusion it is called religion.

Case closed.