Why did Ham Fail?

[DeletedUser]

h0lly: you are confusing having good players in a tribe with being a good tribe. Individual skill can lead to a good tribe, but more often then not it doesn't.

I'd rate CBTF as a much better tribe then ham, even if individually they only have one player i'd rate as good. This is because for all the lack of knowledge they have about the game, they work as a team. That's what a good tribe does. I don't care how many good players there were in HAM!, at the end of the day when push came to shove: you didn't work as a team.

And your strategy with regards to BD is simply laugheable. So while somebody is busy setting your house on fire you decide to blow out a candle because it's easier to do then put out the fire. At the end of the day: that still leaves you with a burned house.

 

[BlindOldBeggar]

...

From my point of view - there is one reason only.
Almost no one really wanted to play. Most of the crew looked completely not interested in what happened in different corners of the tribe. But thats what you get sometimes when you collect people who had seen everything in this game already. It is difficult to keep them interested.

 

[DeletedUser]

[...]
So yeah, HAM was a good tribe :icon_rolleyes:

yeah...! it's hard to find such good ham!

 

[Gicusan]

actualy it was a very good strategu pervie and bad. I belive that was the only way. If they could have hold together and have only stacked the north facing and winning other wars, that would have given them a bigger chance. Unfortunately the sickness was running deeper than that.

 

[Apathetic h0llygh0st]

actualy it was a very good strategu pervie and bad. I belive that was the only way. If they could have hold together and have only stacked the north facing and winning other wars, that would have given them a bigger chance. Unfortunately the sickness was running deeper than that.

That was the plan. Stack the BD border and let them get bored and give up. And in the meanwhile we face our other threats. (primarily Draco)

 

[DeletedUser]

they said: ignore BD. That also includes not stacking.

But given they didn't stack it doesn't matter much what they wanted to do.

 

[Apathetic h0llygh0st]

they said: ignore BD. That also includes not stacking.

But given they didn't stack it doesn't matter much what they wanted to do.

True. :icon_smile:
I wanted to bore you guys till you went inactive :lol:

 

[KoE-CaShMaN]

We failed for many reasons, already stated by Paj. No need to argue or belabour the matter.

However, I rather enjoyed my time in HAM, the war effort and I consider the leadership to have been above par. As one who had to "give up" on some k55 villages to BD, in order to maintain those in k54 against [CRY], having to fight on several fronts had a huge affect on us and we never really did receive support from each other as a tribe normally offers because of it. We tried, we died and some of us live on in appreciation with some of the good things that happened (even if they were few).

I've been on several worlds and fought with many tribes but HAM, even though a loser in w30, will be a good memory for me.

CaSh

 

[DeletedUser]

Ham!!! failed .. end of story ... its like beating a dead horse.

And seriously its a very good plan to stack one side and attack the other lesser sides .. or else you will be dealing with 4 big tribes smacking at you.

Dealing with the lesser of 3 evil's is quicker, smarter, less resourceful and more viable... but i bet you already knew that.

 

[Deleted User - 3135]

Cannot fight as a player in this case.
The proof of that claim has been pointed out a few times and quite frankly its not really something I could cement any further than it always has been.

Right :icon_confused: If you want a credible source on my playing skills, maybe catch Hightower sometime, world 3 was probably the last world in which I did not lead. I was also in speed world 2, rank 3, played against players like Thar and Alpha, with players like Jamm, Vpar2, and the list goes on, they know I can play, do you really think I go from top20/40 because I just suck at end game playing? Is it even possible to suck at end game playing? It's just building and sending noble trains, bloody simple if you ask me.

As a leader the variable's are too many to easily attribute either blame or praise to one person.
It may depend on things other than a leader such as tribal participation, war planners, morale within the tribe, etc.

But at the very top level, a level you claim (or indicate) to be in, a leader should be an example to his followers.
Thats where you fail to deliver.

It's a fair point, one that has been raised before and I respect it, in world 6 I remember doing a great amount of sitting of large accounts under attack which made my small accounts beneficial to my members, though yes if I wanted a perfect option, and should I play this game full time at my computer, I would lead from the front.

Theres the pet we-got-ganbanged theory again.
BD was also fighting (and taking a lot of villages off of) multiple other tribes while they targetted HAM !!
Being ganbanged (even if the claim is true) is no excuse for not being able to take a single village from BD offensively,
Every HAM conquer against BD (and there was just about 13 or so of them) was a retake.
Whats your reason/excuse for that ?
So yeah, HAM was a good tribe :icon_rolleyes:

I commented on Pajuno's post being good, because as he points out it was a number of reasons. BD's fighting was one of those listed, is that the soul reason why we fell? No, course it isn't, its a combination of many. We didn't take a single village from BD (well we did, Mhmmm for example did, but I'll accept your bad assumption anyway) is because offensively all attacks were centered around Draco and Beyond, we could hardly hit offensives on Draco, Beyond, BD and [CRY] and assume to get a sustained village takings would we?

 

[DeletedUser22924]

h0lly: you are confusing having good players in a tribe with being a good tribe. Individual skill can lead to a good tribe, but more often then not it doesn't.

I'd rate CBTF as a much better tribe then ham, even if individually they only have one player i'd rate as good. This is because for all the lack of knowledge they have about the game, they work as a team. That's what a good tribe does. I don't care how many good players there were in HAM!, at the end of the day when push came to shove: you didn't work as a team.

And your strategy with regards to BD is simply laugheable. So while somebody is busy setting your house on fire you decide to blow out a candle because it's easier to do then put out the fire. At the end of the day: that still leaves you with a burned house.

whos is this mysterious player u rate as a good:icon_eek:

 

[Pajuno]

Is it even possible to suck at end game playing? It's just building and sending noble trains, bloody simple if you ask me.

The rest means nothing to me... petty arguing.

But i do have to comment on this statement....

Please dont come accross as such... End game is part of the hardest part.. Everyone left has to be at least decent, there is no more noob nobling, there is no more freebies... You have to work for everything and coops and plans have to be hammered out far better here and now than early on...


I can say this now, cause i have lived thru opening a world again.. Only this time i knew what i was doing as opposed to my time on W6....

 

[Deleted User - 3135]

The rest means nothing to me... petty arguing.

But i do have to comment on this statement....

Please dont come accross as such... End game is part of the hardest part.. Everyone left has to be at least decent, there is no more noob nobling, there is no more freebies... You have to work for everything and coops and plans have to be hammered out far better here and now than early on...


I can say this now, cause i have lived thru opening a world again.. Only this time i knew what i was doing as opposed to my time on W6....

I don't know, I just can't disagree more. Late world there is a huge amount of freebies, there is TOO many freebies, tribes often don't have enough nobles, look at world 1-3, the early worlds. It gets worse and worse as the world gets older. Those that are left are not left because they are the best but because they are more committed and dedicated. This is the sad truth of the game we call Tribalwars.

 

[Gicusan]

The rest means nothing to me... petty arguing.


End game is part of the hardest part.. Everyone left has to be at least decent, there is no more noob nobling, there is no more freebies... You have to work for everything and coops and plans have to be hammered out far better here and now than early on...

sure. check Sas and their 2 min trains and superb coordination. There are still guys that given 40 unatended villas cannpt ennoble at a rate better than 2-3 villas per week. so noobs stay around, build all the barbs and outlast many good players. here and everywhere else.

 

[DeletedUser]

I know the answer to the topic question:

So they have more time for "real life".

I'm jealous.

 

[DeletedUser]

Right :icon_confused: If you want a credible source on my playing skills, maybe catch Hightower sometime, world 3 was probably the last world in which I did not lead. I was also in speed world 2, rank 3, played against players like Thar and Alpha, with players like Jamm, Vpar2, and the list goes on, they know I can play, do you really think I go from top20/40 because I just suck at end game playing? Is it even possible to suck at end game playing? It's just building and sending noble trains, bloody simple if you ask me.

Regardless of whether you suck at endgame playing or not (and it may be a difficult stage of the game even if it allows for some low talent players to survive) the stage that W30 is not the endgame.
The size of your account at the time it lost almost all its villages is not the end game by a long shot.
If you consider it such, you need to revise your concept of TW quite a bit.

I commented on Pajuno's post being good, because as he points out it was a number of reasons. BD's fighting was one of those listed, is that the soul reason why we fell? No, course it isn't, its a combination of many. We didn't take a single village from BD (well we did, Mhmmm for example did, but I'll accept your bad assumption anyway) is because offensively all attacks were centered around Draco and Beyond, we could hardly hit offensives on Draco, Beyond, BD and [CRY] and assume to get a sustained village takings would we?

As far as attacking or being targetted by multiple tribes is concerned, BD has (and im pretty sure THE as well) been up agaisnt 4-5 tribes and taking a ton of villages from them almost constantly since nobles came out.

You argue that HAM did not have the resources to take vilalges from all 4 attackers you mentioned (and thats quite beleivable) but in that case the focus of attention should be the tribe thats doing the most damage to you (BD) and not the tribe that you can potentially do the most damage to (draco. and Beyond).
Because thats the easy/cowards way out.

To add to badlapje's excelletn metaphor regarding a burning house, if one guy is trying to stab you with a machete and another guy witha butter knife, who do you chose to fight ?
And its not as though theres a lot to lose but virtual villages in an online game.
Why not just have some self respect and fight your most dangerous threat to the best of your ability whether you win or lose.

 

[DeletedUser]

h0lly: you are confusing having good players in a tribe with being a good tribe. Individual skill can lead to a good tribe, but more often then not it doesn't.

I'd rate CBTF as a much better tribe then ham, even if individually they only have one player i'd rate as good. This is because for all the lack of knowledge they have about the game, they work as a team. That's what a good tribe does. I don't care how many good players there were in HAM!, at the end of the day when push came to shove: you didn't work as a team.

And your strategy with regards to BD is simply laugheable. So while somebody is busy setting your house on fire you decide to blow out a candle because it's easier to do then put out the fire. At the end of the day: that still leaves you with a burned house.

I apologize to HAM!!! for what i am about to say:

I agree

somewhat at least.

I did not feel like a team anymore when i returned to HAM!!! after i left, It had grown into something that did invite good players, but i don't believe there were much working together, i know for a fact, that at least most of the parts that were involved with BD worked together, but not having the rest to back us up weren't fun..

I must admit myself too, that i could have been more supportive, but due to just getting an account, and having to set it up, i were not.

I have started fighting now though, far too late if i might say so. HAM!!! did fail, and thereøs nothing we can say that will change the outcome of that situation, BD proved the better team fighters in this one.

I give you my Salutations. But not my surrender.

 

[KoE-CaShMaN]

i think ham had lots of players who were good bullies , got very good starts but couldn't actualy play.

case in point:

one ham player near me had farmed and nobled small players in our tribe since the start . however i (who had half his points) mangaed to noble 5 villages of him in a week despite the fact he was active .

Ham players from what i saw could only attack players with small accounts . they would have failed anyway when all the easy villages were gone .

Who, of any decent size, has not taken advantage of some player, at some time along the way. In order to grow, one must hit the weak, hit them early and hit them hard to become the best possible player. This does not make one a bully but rather, we tend to make heros from those that make the largest gains. I'm not saying that either opinion is right, bully or hero.

The case in point is rather weak since this same player has been attacked by many Draco players, has helped his neighbour against [CRY] and has sent support to other HAM members. A bully would not have done so and is being hit hard because of it.

IMO

 

[DeletedUser]

" To add to badlapje's excelletn metaphor regarding a burning house, if one guy is trying to stab you with a machete and another guy witha butter knife, who do you chose to fight ? "

The WORST Metaphor ever.. Both can kill you very very easily... I been in the presence of a idiot slicing his wrist right open as he missed the guy he was trying to attack and sliced his own wrist... almost bled to death

Get 4 Way'ed and then you can summarise about how you would react to the situation.

Its been said before .. and ill repeat it .. there isnt anyone good enough or with enough balls to take on BD, Every single tribe to engage them has fallen apart internally .. INCLUDING ham!

Cheers.

 

[the pink panther]

AHEM I don't think we would shy away from a fight if it came. I think what annoyed everyone is HAM's cocky attitude, like how they gloated when they beat boo! and Ctrl you cant brag then moan when others do.