Abortion debate topic

[DeletedUser]

To pykers question about detecting the babies defects if it has any.

My view is this: I am obviously not a mother so my opinion amy not be too understanding of women (sorry =/) Do you really think someonew ith a defect leads a happy life? I think that some do and some dont. Depending on the defect, I would abort. If the defect is something that the human can live with and lead a generally normal and happy life with, I say go for it. Let the baby live. But if the defect is too dominant over the human's life, I would say abort. Now, there is the argument that the baby deserves a life. es, it does, but a bed ridden life or a mental illness life, anything that is really catastrophic is just heart wrenching for both parties

However... this comes to the balance of the human race. We need imperfections. We need mutations in people (mutations as in different traits physically and mentally) to evolve. But that is a completely differnet topic

So er, basically.. I say it is up to the mother's decision, but make it before too long and just think whther or not the human will live a happy life with the defect. Whether it can live a relatively normal life.

 

[DeletedUser]

Well, im biased considering im from holland, where pretty much everything is legal...

But i have no problem with abortion, i think its for everyone themselves to decide...

And i was raised katholic... but seriously, i have NO problem with it.

you dutch too :icon_razz:

yeah...pretty much everything is legal I've heard :icon_cool:

and btw...katholic is spelt catholic, thought I'd let you know people might think its something else:icon_wink:

and personally, I don't promote it but in the end its up to the people who are having the baby...yes, people, usually its a decision between the 2 people who made the baby together :lol:

 

[DeletedUser]

To pykers question about detecting the babies defects if it has any.

My view is this: I am obviously not a mother so my opinion amy not be too understanding of women (sorry =/) Do you really think someonew ith a defect leads a happy life? I think that some do and some dont. Depending on the defect, I would abort. If the defect is something that the human can live with and lead a generally normal and happy life with, I say go for it. Let the baby live. But if the defect is too dominant over the human's life, I would say abort. Now, there is the argument that the baby deserves a life. es, it does, but a bed ridden life or a mental illness life, anything that is really catastrophic is just heart wrenching for both parties

However... this comes to the balance of the human race. We need imperfections. We need mutations in people (mutations as in different traits physically and mentally) to evolve. But that is a completely differnet topic

So er, basically.. I say it is up to the mother's decision, but make it before too long and just think whther or not the human will live a happy life with the defect. Whether it can live a relatively normal life.

I feel sorry for the people who live their life pretty much dead :icon_sad: Thats no life at all, and seriously if I was them, I would want to just have my life over with...sorry, but its the truth. As for humans being dependent on defects...LOL, not defects, but changes in the way our DNA is arranged yes I guess so.

 

[DeletedUser]

but changes in the way our DNA is arranged yes I guess so.

you are saying what I am saying in a different way. mutations, defects, they are all changes in DNA and its arrangement. Think on what you want to say because this is the second time where you have repeated what I have said in a different format

 

[nathaniak]

Not all 'syndromes' are worth abortion. Many disorders, such as ASD, affect people in different ways. One of my best friends has ADHD, and we get on really well. My point is although I am pro-abortion, I do not believe it should be the mother's choice. The mother can apply, but the decision should be made by the government. A foetus should not be aborted just because it may not be totally 'normal'

 

[DeletedUser]

Not all 'syndromes' are worth abortion. Many disorders, such as ASD, affect people in different ways. One of my best friends has ADHD, and we get on really well. My point is although I am pro-abortion, I do not believe it should be the mother's choice. The mother can apply, but the decision should be made by the government. A foetus should not be aborted just because it may not be totally 'normal'

Yeah, because trusting the government to make the best choice is always the right thing to do. :icon_eek:

I don't think anyone is going to abort a baby because of ADHD, or ADD, are anything like that. I'm speaking more of serious genetical diseases and defects, like Down Syndrome, and others I CBA to look up right now.

 

[nathaniak]

I mean the parents might not want an autistic baby, even though many autisitic people can live good lives.

 

[nathaniak]

And to all those who say 'abortion is murder': by the same logic, should it be illegal for a woman not to be pregnant?

 

[DeletedUser]

I mean the parents might not want an autistic baby, even though many autisitic people can live good lives.

If you actually knew what was involved with raising an autistic person, especially someone who is severely autistic, you would probably change your opinion in the matter.

Fact is, the government isn't going to be raising those children, so why should they be able to tell the parents what to do?

 

[DeletedUser26129]

you dutch too :icon_razz:

yeah...pretty much everything is legal I've heard :icon_cool:

and btw...katholic is spelt catholic, thought I'd let you know people might think its something else:icon_wink:

and personally, I don't promote it but in the end its up to the people who are having the baby...yes, people, usually its a decision between the 2 people who made the baby together :lol:

Yeah sorry, my lack of the english language plays with me sometimes

 

[nathaniak]

If a parent has a baby, they should not be able to use abortion to 'get rid' of a baby they do not want...

 

[DeletedUser]

If a parent has a baby, they should not be able to use abortion to 'get rid' of a baby they do not want...

Why not? Who are you to tell them they have to have the kid? Are you going to raise it for them because they don't want to? Or should we just add another kid into the already over-taxed foster parent/adoption system?

 

[DeletedUser]

I agree with Pyker that the government shouldn't make the decision..

Abortion is legal in a lot of countries, where I'm from, it is not. In case you're wondering, that's Ireland.

We had a referendum on this in 2002 or something like that, can't remember exactly. 650,000 or so voted to make abortion legal, yet 660,000 or so voted to keep it illegal. There was only a 10,000 vote difference.

So, we are kept with illegal abortion. Do I think that's right? No. Why? Because people simply go abroad to get abortions anyway.

Do I think abortion, as a whole, should be legalised? Yes. I didn't think so until very recently, when I actually began to think about it. Up until that time, I followed the strict Catholic teaching that abortion = bad. I also followed the strict Catholic teaching that questioning Catholic teachings = bad. However, I've changed (due to the Ferns...McCarthy and Murray reports..).

I now believe that if God gave us free will (considering that this is mainly a moral, ethical and religious debate - I feel it relevant to mention religion here), then why can we not decide for ourselves whether to keep the child or not? What about cases of rape? What about cases where the mother could die if she has the baby? What about cases where the child will be paralysed forever? What about cases where it is known the child will not survive?

Everything needs to be looked at on an individual basis, you can't just say "Abortion is bad, illegalise it." However, you can say "We cannot say whether abortion is bad or not, so we'll leave the choice up to you." For that reason, I think it should be legalised everywhere, including in my own country, and if I got the chance to vote in another referendum, I'd vote to make it legal - simply because I do not believe it is my place to deny a woman the right to decide her own future.

Just my opinion on the matter. Feel free to argue it as you will. I will likely keep up with this thread, as it is interesting, but I won't be arguing much in it.

 

[DeletedUser]

Theres two scenarios where abortion is acceptable :

1) When the baby is conceived because the mother was raped
2) When delivering the baby is likely to kill the mother

Outside of those two i cannot really see any justification for taking the fetus' life. The baby being disabled and the baby being an accidental conception thats likely to badly disrupt the parents lives are not viable reasons to carry out abortion.

 

[DeletedUser]

Theres two scenarios where abortion is acceptable :

1) When the baby is conceived because the mother was raped
2) When delivering the baby is likely to kill the mother

Outside of those two i cannot really see any justification for taking the fetus' life. The baby being disabled and the baby being an accidental conception thats likely to badly disrupt the parents lives are not viable reasons to carry out abortion.

That is an acceptable view to have, as long as you respect the fact that other people don't view it the same as you do, and you do not interfere with their right to make their own choices as to whether or not to have an abortion.

 

[DeletedUser26129]

Theres two scenarios where abortion is acceptable :

1) When the baby is conceived because the mother was raped
2) When delivering the baby is likely to kill the mother

Outside of those two i cannot really see any justification for taking the fetus' life. The baby being disabled and the baby being an accidental conception thats likely to badly disrupt the parents lives are not viable reasons to carry out abortion.

PERVIS!!!!!!!!!


OMG!!!!

Guy's meet the 4th best leader in this game....

first obviously is kingwoods.
second gzed (he claims im the best, i say he is...)
Third is me (yes i am arrogant, get over it)

4th, obviously is pervis, he is incredible, and i have been begging him for ages to join us

 

[DeletedUser]

I firmly believe in choises. I think that evey one should be able to make their own decisions on about pretty much everything. So you can say im very liberal. ofcourse their are acceptions and people shouldnt be able to make sertain choises (like murders and other crimes) but that is besides the point.

I think every should have abortion as an option. That doesnt mean however that is support the choise. I would rather have the partents to choise for adoption as there are thousands of families who want to have babies but for some reason cant.

To point of abortion when there are birth deffects found in the fetus. I dont think this would be good thing. Why? Easy im taking the netherlands as an example. The organissations that take care of people with downsyndrom or something like it are on of the biggest employers the netherlands has.
If kids with downsymdrom would be aborted it would mean a great loss of work wich would be a great downfall in the current economy.
And i work a lot with people who have downsymdrom and i would say that most of them are a lot happier then normal people are. They can also bring so much joy to the people arround them. That is my experience at least.

 

[DeletedUser]

PERVIS!!!!!!!!!


OMG!!!!

Guy's meet the 4th best leader in this game....

first obviously is kingwoods.
second gzed (he claims im the best, i say he is...)
Third is me (yes i am arrogant, get over it)

4th, obviously is pervis, he is incredible, and i have been begging him for ages to join us

i luuuuuuuurrrrrrveeeee youuuuuuuuuuu :icon_redface: :icon_redface:

 

[DeletedUser]

wow pervis are you coming back and joining manic???? i hope not

i doubt u remember me.