to be honest i dont think it should be voted by a state, but an overall majority of that religion so all Christians should have a say and the overall % should be used instead of one state saying no, another country saying yes but still the same religion.
So we're lumping all Christians together? Quakers, Shakers, Catholics, Episcopalians, Mormons, Amish... Yeah, I don't think that's really gonna work. And seeing as marriage has legal implications, and in the US we separate church and state (supposedly), I think that's even less likely to work.
I take it she's probably about 9 to 11 years old or so? Only just becoming aware enough, I did not know anything about sex when I was 9/10 years old and would literally shit my pants if anybody said 'shit' around me. When she gets older she might end up getting teased about it and realising that her parents are lesbians.
She's 10. I don't know how much she knows about sex because I only get to see her every other summer. :icon_cry: But it's probably not a lot because her Momma is very protective of her. I know she realizes her moms are lesbian. She's talked about that before, and she's told me about the initial confusion with figuring out what to call each of them so they wouldn't both come running if she said, "Mom."
Response to bolded word: Yeah, it's a possibility. So why not work to minimize that possibility as much as we can?
For me I learnt about it when I was 11 or something, and it really wasn't that awkward. But think about it - if the child has had external influences (presumably from friends) saying that gays are bad, evil and disgusting people, it might produce a significant backlash from the child when they realise that their parents aren't their parents (biologically). Heck, at least with adoption you might be able to mask over the fact you aren't the child's real parents well.
Once again, work to teach people to be more tolerant of differences in sexualities.
So it would be good to lie to the child? Some relative would probably spill the beans accidentally...
That's why you preach tolerance, as Druid said in his massive wall. No one has said that it will be easy, but God knows change is never easy.
Speaking as someone who is bisexual, I know I've been attracted to other girls all my life.
My quote as response to your quote. :icon_wink: Although I saw already that Dark corrected this.
Also, speaking of worldview, if the homosexual parents teach tolerance (like I'm assuming they would, because... duh?), then maybe this child will have a better view of the world then most of the people out there who aren't nearly as tolerant... just maybe.
+1 (or more, if you prefer)
But how excactly would the child know that? The child only knows that his been abandoned
"Knows"? How would they know they were abandoned unless they'd been told that?
Or have none
Or pick a tolerant one...
You are right with the swearing things - kids are sexually ignorant in their younger age usually.
You'd be surprised... I learned how to use a condom in 5th grade.
Preaching tolerance will not change the conservatives. Ultimately the only way to change society will be to see generational change - yes, this means all these old right-wing Christian conservatives will have to die out, in short. It sounds rough, but I know even my Grandparents or aunts and uncles would not approve of my views as an Atheist. (I'm a closet Atheist to my Family, as basically all of my extended family are Christians, aside from a few).
But with any luck, the younger generations can and will change. Things are slow, but we just have to do our best with as much support as we have. And by making same-sex marriage more mainstream, it will be easier for new people to come to accept it.
And on the note of teaching them that it doesn't work - do you know how controversial this will become? People will accuse the government (or whoever is writing the curriculum/teaching this) that they are spreading false testament and lies, and make comparisons to the reigns of Hitler or extreme communism. To say it does work is a horrible and ineffective solution. And unless we brainwash the whole world into thinking its possible (even though its not), people will try and find it fails, and it will end up becoming a giant joke.
I've never heard such a stupid idea in my life. You can't just go off and rewrite the human anatomy.
I was gonna try to clarify for Synergy, but I saw he beat me to it. :icon_neutral:
I'm completely against the idea of homosexual couples having children. Though homosexuality is not a choice, its going to have too many negative effects on the child as they enter later life. A mother and a father have two separate roles in parenthood. Unless we can see one of the people in the homosexual marriage inherit a personality 'and everything' of the opposite sex (i.e. everything but the 'private parts', yes that would include doing womanly/manly things), it just wouldn't work out. The child would be at a disadvantage, whether it be that neither parent can cook well, neither parent can clean effectively or neither parent is into sport/gives them a male influence.
I know Cliff already responded to this, but I couldn't help myself.
Um... My dad cooks. My mom microwaves and throws things in the toaster. Oh, and she can boil water too. :icon_cool: Yeah, my mom is the one who does the cleaning. But it's very rare for her to clean unless we have company coming over. She hates cleaning, and she makes that well known. Oh, and guess who stayed home with me the first few years or so of my life? My dad did. My mom was busy working. She was a geologist at the time. (She's a teacher now, but she teaches math and science.) Yeah, that's right. A woman who is involved in science! :icon_surprised: What is this world coming to?!
Are we seriously still beholden to antiquated gender roles? I hope not. I want to be allowed to own property. And I want to be allowed to vote. These are just two of many things women used to not be allowed to do. Times change, as people have said before. In opposite-sex couples, the "feminine" role and the "masculine" role are no longer so clear cut.
Keep it polite guys.
Levy
Levy <3
oh my oh me what a commotion. its taken me the best part of a day to read through all of this, im both appalled and delighted by some of the opinions expressed in here.
Willy <3 (I deleted the rest of it so my text wall would be slightly smaller.)
As druid so kindly pointed out on skype, weddings and marriages are different. Marriages are state-recognized and grant certain privileges, adoption being one of them. And that is the reason I so oppose homosexual marriage. If they are willing to give up the privilege to adopt, then let them be married. However, this probably won't happen, therefore homosexual marriage should become/remain illegal.
Wait, adoption is a privilege? I think the courts would disagree with you there. They've previously extended adoption rights to gay couples, and overturned laws banning gay couples from adopting.
You're so blunt... :lol:
Wow.... probably the most stupid idea I've heard yet. Have schools teach that what the child's parents practice is biologically impossible, and therefore they cannot be a biological descendant, telling them they are adopted. Yep, that'll work. Or tell them it does work, which is a load of bullshit, as anyone with two brain cells to rub together could figure out.
Another thing I wanted to clarify, but Synergy beat me.
You use words like tolerance like you actually think it's possible. 2 of the worlds 3 largest religions, encompassing over half of the worlds population expressly forbid homosexuality as one of the worst possible sins. Until religion is done away with, there will be little change. And as for homosexual parents teaching tolerance, who would they teach it for? They'd teach the child that they are persecuted by the horrible people in the government and the rest of society condemns them. There is no such thing as universal tolerance.
Not true. Episcopalians have openly homosexual bishops, and some Quakers perform same-sex weddings. So that rules out the Christians as a whole. I don't know as much as I would like about Islam and homosexuality.
So your suggestion is... to lie? Oh, brilliant. Let's all tell our children what they want to hear, so they come crashing down to reality when they find out the truth. Yep, that won't bite us in the ass at all.
Heck, at least with adoption you might be able to mask over the fact you aren't the child's real parents well.
I refer you to Lewder's post. Are we gonna lie to the kids or not?
Of course it does. Heterosexual couples who adopt never have to tell the child they are adopted, and if they go through enough trouble, they can prevent the child from EVER finding out. They can bury the records so deep, it'd take a century and a half to find them. Or, they can wait until the child is old enough to accept it, then tell them. A homosexual couple can't do that, because the moment the child realizes that homosexuality cannot result in children, they'll know.
Wait, why would a parent ever want to lie to a child all their life? Are they so worried about their parenting abilities that they think the child would no longer love them? But haven't you been going on about how much better heterosexual couples are at raising children? :icon_confused:
Not even then. So long as people follow Islam and Christianity, the worlds two largest religions, homosexuality will NEVER be tolerated. And while the number of Atheists grow, not fast enough to change the moral views in any of our lifetimes.
Scroll up a bit... Already responded to this.
I don't think it'd be compared to Hitler, but yes, it would make the educational system a joke, and the government would be a laughingstock.
So the US educational system isn't already a joke? But that aside, Synergy already responded to this bit.
That is possible, but I just admit, unlikely. The main disadvantage would be the ostracisation(sp?) from society. And that is putting the end result mildly.
So teach people that homosexuality isn't bad. >.< Because I have yet to see anything showing that it is.
Single parents are standardly biological parents. As you can read above, I disagree with the lack of "womanly/manly" influence being that large of a factor, but single parents are still real parents, where homosexual parents cannot be.
Real parents = the ones who love you. Or at least that's how I'd define it.
And for the lolz...
