lets settle the alliance vs. family tribe discussion, once and for all

[DeletedUser]

Considering that LFKD is in the middle of this debate, whether they are an alliance or family tribe - it's not off topic. :icon_wink:

 

[DeletedUser4665]

Well here is my opinion:

Family:
When I think of family, I think feudal kingdom. By definition, families are all united under an "alpha tribe". Kind of like feudal knights under a king/lord. They can choose whether they want to support or not which usually happens in families.

A Good Family:
When I think of a good family, I think British empire. By definition, families are all united under an "alpha tribe". The British empire forced cooperation. Where the other parts do not have a choice in participating. Help, or Leave (and be crushed later).

A Bad Alliance:
When I think of a bad alliance, I think UN. By definition, an alliance is supposed to be a mutual support, but most alliances are simply NAPs. I think more people use this definition of an alliance.

Alliance:
When I think of an alliance, I think an efficient UN. By definition, alliances are not under any central authority. The UN is obviously not under any kind of central authority. It is a core group which cooperates, but not by force.

 

[DeletedUser]

I think the problem you all have is that you are restricting yourselves to describing a tribe alliance as a 'Family' or 'Not a Family'. This is a serious flaw as there are many, many ways to have a Family. To even try and label tribes and tribe alliances is kind of stupid since every single one works differently.....but alas, if you feel like giving labels, at least give yourselves more than 2 options (family, not family).

I propose:
Empire - Allies with a head ruler (1 tribe controls or dictates what the others do)
Family - Allies who share a basic Diplomacy list (may vary slightly, but not too much). Work together when needed in attacking and/or defending. Generally share a common name.
Allied-Family - Could be considered the same as Family, but simply missing any common name with allies.
Independent (no family) - A solitary tribe. They may have allies, but their diplomacy list is rarely the same as their allies. Their ally's diplomacy list has no large effect on their own diplomacy list.

But hey, even this extended list doesn't do justice to the types of alliances/tribes that exist.

 

[DeletedUser19924]

there are both good families and then there are also bad families, the problem is that most of the time you only hear about the bad family tribes.

 

[DeletedUser]

I propose:
Empire - Allies with a head ruler (1 tribe controls or dictates what the others do)
Family - Allies who share a basic Diplomacy list (may vary slightly, but not too much). Work together when needed in attacking and/or defending. Generally share a common name.
Allied-Family - Could be considered the same as Family, but simply missing any common name with allies.
Independent (no family) - A solitary tribe. They may have allies, but their diplomacy list is rarely the same as their allies. Their ally's diplomacy list has no large effect on their own diplomacy list.

But hey, even this extended list doesn't do justice to the types of alliances/tribes that exist.

You did miss out the normal alliance/coalition though, one without a central authority.
I also don't see how an Empire could exist in practice. Of course it is possible, but why would that global leader have a different diplomacy in each tribe?

 

[DeletedUser]

how I see it

A Coalition, is a group of tribes that all share the same diplomacy list.

A Tribal Family, is a group of tribes that all share the same diplomacy list, and also namesake.

Coalition = Family, with the only difference being namesake.

as far as one being better then the other, I see little difference.

 

[DeletedUser]

how I see it

How I see it, this entire thread is just a scam for the LFKD to say "Look! Most people say we're not a family, so we're liek, not a family! " if most people think they're not.

They should just suck it up and stop whining about a mere classification... I would hate to see what their forums look like over something that REALLY matters. :icon_rolleyes:

 

[DeletedUser]

So have we come to an overall consesus?

We need a vote thread

 

[DeletedUser23324]

So have we come to an overall consesus?

We need a vote thread

Have we?

I see many different definitions.

 

[DeletedUser]

Not to cause problems or anything...but why does it even matter what classification you have? People are going to think an call you whatever you want no matter what so why bother? Anyways also who cares if your a family or not it doesnt change how you play the game, nor does it change the skill of your players if you are a family or not. Players will stay the same their skill lvl will stay the same and everyone is going to think what they want to think no matter what you say or anyone says about it. But thats just my 2 cents.


Also to keep this on topic no matter what you choose to be a family or alliance the fact remains the same that if it works for you then good. If it keeps your members in your tribe and keeps them loyal then why not go with it. Each tribe has chosen to go its own way, because that's what works for them. People join the tribe because that's what they want to be in. So like I said if it works for you and your tribe thats good because there are a lot of tribes out there that it doesn't work for them and they have to find their own way to make it in this world.

Now I'm sure someone will flame at me for posting this, but again I dont care you can think what you want but this works for our tribe and thats all that matters to us.

CZENS SCIOVA Diplomat

 

[DeletedUser23324]

Not to cause problems or anything...but why does it even matter what classification you have? People are going to think an call you whatever you want no matter what so why bother? Anyways also who cares if your a family or not it doesnt change how you play the game, nor does it change the skill of your players if you are a family or not. Players will stay the same their skill lvl will stay the same and everyone is going to think what they want to think no matter what you say or anyone says about it. But thats just my 2 cents.


Also to keep this on topic no matter what you choose to be a family or alliance the fact remains the same that if it works for you then good. If it keeps your members in your tribe and keeps them loyal then why not go with it. Each tribe has chosen to go its own way, because that's what works for them. People join the tribe because that's what they want to be in. So like I said if it works for you and your tribe thats good because there are a lot of tribes out there that it doesn't work for them and they have to find their own way to make it in this world.

Now I'm sure someone will flame at me for posting this, but again I dont care you can think what you want but this works for our tribe and thats all that matters to us.

CZENS SCIOVA Diplomat

Is an excellent post, i agree certainly about your first statement.

The topics aim is to debate and inform more than to say if it is good or bad. It mainly poped up due to the words Family tribe etc, being thrown around with little or no aknowledgement of what they mean. Generally many of us on the LFKD side belieive that PnP'ers mainly from TSE and VVV to be honest, are delibrately thrown these comments about to distrubt topics and in general Flame (MY OPINION). Hence to try to divert these comment that are clearly made to make us flame back TPC makes a topic to keep this 'debate' in one place.

 

[tpwch]

Not to cause problems or anything...but why does it even matter what classification you have? People are going to think an call you whatever you want no matter what so why bother? Anyways also who cares if your a family or not it doesnt change how you play the game, nor does it change the skill of your players if you are a family or not. Players will stay the same their skill lvl will stay the same and everyone is going to think what they want to think no matter what you say or anyone says about it. But thats just my 2 cents.

Well said. I agree completly.

 

[DeletedUser]

Not to cause problems or anything...but why does it even matter what classification you have? People are going to think an call you whatever you want no matter what so why bother? Anyways also who cares if your a family or not it doesnt change how you play the game, nor does it change the skill of your players if you are a family or not. Players will stay the same their skill lvl will stay the same and everyone is going to think what they want to think no matter what you say or anyone says about it. But thats just my 2 cents.


Also to keep this on topic no matter what you choose to be a family or alliance the fact remains the same that if it works for you then good. If it keeps your members in your tribe and keeps them loyal then why not go with it. Each tribe has chosen to go its own way, because that's what works for them. People join the tribe because that's what they want to be in. So like I said if it works for you and your tribe thats good because there are a lot of tribes out there that it doesn't work for them and they have to find their own way to make it in this world.

Now I'm sure someone will flame at me for posting this, but again I dont care you can think what you want but this works for our tribe and thats all that matters to us.

CZENS SCIOVA Diplomat

probably the smartest post so far.

I really dont see why people keep discussing this issue, when the type of coalition really has no or very little relevance in the outcome i the game. It all depends on good ogranization, leadership and strategy and eventaully how deep the commitment of a member tribe to the coalition is. An alliance can be just as bad as any family under bad leadership and organization. Likewise any family can be as effective as any alliance given the proper organization and leadership.

Further coalition are useless when the first sign of trouble and its members start breaking away to avoid the problem.

People can keep branding (or at least the anti LFKD pnpers) LFKD as a family and even if by some fluke of nature LFKD itself admits that they are a family, it will never change the fact that their good organization and leadership plus each member tribe's strong commitment to the coalition is what really brought them to were they are.

A coalition will fail not because of its type or classification. But because somwhere along the way, their leadership and organization didnt pull thru.

 

[DeletedUser]

Well said. I agree completly.

Then why did you make this thread?

 

[tpwch]

Then why did you make this thread?

So we could have a discussion about it? Just because I have an opinion about something doesn't mean that I find it useless to see what other peoples opinions are.

 

[DeletedUser]

So we could have a discussion about it? Just because I have an opinion about something doesn't mean that I find it useless to see what other peoples opinions are.

You agreed to a statement that basically said wether or not the LFKD was an alliance or family tribe didn't matter, yet the thread title is " lets settle the alliance vs. family tribe discussion, once and for all ".

In my opinion, you wouldn't make this thread if you didn't care. Unless you were an attention whore.

 

[DeletedUser]

You agreed to a statement that basically said wether or not the LFKD was an alliance or family tribe didn't matter, yet the thread title is " lets settle the alliance vs. family tribe discussion, once and for all ".

In my opinion, you wouldn't make this thread if you didn't care. Unless you were an attention whore.

To have one thread on it instead of the debate popping up in every thread? Good work tpwch on getting the discussion to one place.

I believe your triple posts and spam are well known around here so please, no throwing stones in you lil glass house.

 

[tpwch]

My main purpose was, as I stated in the first post, to try to get it out of everyones system so it doesn't have to come up in almost every thread, as it has done previously. So far it seems to be working.

 

[DeletedUser]

My main purpose was, as I stated in the first post, to try to get it out of everyones system so it doesn't have to come up in almost every thread, as it has done previously. So far it seems to be working.

Read my sig, in my opinion it was his drunken post that spurred this entire thread.


Funny thing is I never called PKs a family tribe.

 

[DeletedUser]

My main purpose was, as I stated in the first post, to try to get it out of everyones system so it doesn't have to come up in almost every thread, as it has done previously. So far it seems to be working.

Yes, of course it was.