Disscusion:Elitist pigs VS Mass recruting noobs

[DeletedUser]

Those two statatements could not be more at odds with each other if you tried. Your not in the caliber of Random, but you are just as good as them:icon_neutral:

Let me provide a modern, out of game example, for I clearly have insignificant knowledge to yours about past worlds. Hopefully you have a life outside of this game so you can relate to this...:icon_rolleyes:

The New York Giants were not of the caliber of the New England Patriots in the Super Bowl two years ago. The Patriots were clearly the better team on paper, having had an undefeated season until their loss to the Giants. The Giants were over-matched on paper, but ended up just as good, if not better.

Exactly, and trust me fighting an opponent of equal size or similarity size is much different than these other fights. Keeping your members from fear is easy when you have a considerable size advantage, so much of this game is about the mental aspect until you fight someone that is comparable in size at least in my opinion absolutely nothing can be told about you or your tribe. Which is my point, you have achieved nothing so far, you may achieve something but that is neither here nor there it has not happened yet....

Its not like we didn't have wars with other tribes. We actually defeated two top 10 tribes. So again, not just sitting around, or using our size, which stated before, wasn't even that sizable, to our advantage.

 

[mattcurr]

Let me provide a modern, out of game example, for I clearly have insignificant knowledge to yours about past worlds. Hopefully you have a life outside of this game so you can relate to this...:icon_rolleyes:

And as we can see me slowly destroy all of your points with logic and reasoning we get down the personal insults. You were doing so well until this, you were wrong but respectable. I was not saying your tribe sucked merely you have not shown anything yet.

The New York Giants were not of the caliber of the New England Patriots in the Super Bowl two years ago. The Patriots were clearly the better team on paper, having had an undefeated season until their loss to the Giants. The Giants were over-matched on paper, but ended up just as good, if not better.

And yes the Giants played in the Supper Bowl until you play in the Supper bowl your argument is moot you have yet to do it.....

Its not like we didn't have wars with other tribes. We actually defeated two top 10 tribes. So again, not just sitting around, or using our size, which stated before, wasn't even that sizable, to our advantage.

There is a huge difference between a #2 or #3 tribe and a #6 or # 7 tribe in regards to size that is why I asked about top 5 tribes. Again for the sake of repeating myself until you fight someone of comparable tribe I cannot accurately judge your tribe. It does not mean it sucks merely you have nothing to rest your hat on yet.

 

[DeletedUser]

And as we can see me slowly destroy all of your points with logic and reasoning we get down the personal insults. You were doing so well until this, you were wrong but respectable. I was not saying your tribe sucked merely you have not shown anything yet.

Merely a joke as I figured everyone watched or at least knew of this. If it offended you I apologize. I am not one for personal insults.

And thanks, but I don't really know if there is a right or wrong on this. Just my opinion on an opinion question versus your own. :icon_wink:

And yes the Giants played in the Supper Bowl until you play in the Supper bowl your argument is moot you have yet to do it.....

First of all on a side note, I think the TW team should think about doing this. They may already have something similar but not to my knowledge. Have 8 tribes play a speed round on 4 worlds, 1v1. Each tribe starts with advanced villages so that nobling can start right away. Whichever tribe wins after a set period advances to the next round, and then you play a 'Super Bowl' with the last two tribes.

Back on topic though, we were the #2 tribe. We were right there, but the large scale war between us and Random just never played out.

There is a huge difference between a #2 or #3 tribe and a #6 or # 7 tribe in regards to size that is why I asked about top 5 tribes. Again for the sake of repeating myself until you fight someone of comparable tribe I cannot accurately judge your tribe. It does not mean it sucks merely you have nothing to rest your hat on yet.

Like I too said before, our tribe was in no position to adequately fight another top 5 tribe. We owned our area and took on the tribes we could. We beat them all, and that is why I still come back to the point that our "mass recruiting" tribe was still a prominent force on the world.

 

[Michael Corleone.]

Hey Zeus, congratulations on leading the Rank 1 tribe on W39 first off. But let's face it, Random could and would beat your tribe. Random was one of the most talented tribes I have been apart of, the skill was off the charts. Your tribe was high in ranks, but didn't really do anything special when Random was around and on top. After Random left, your tribe gets Rank 1. That's not really an accomplishment.

If V actually defeated Random one on one, then yes, that would be an accomplishment. Nobody wanted to fight Random towards the end of Random's reign. Everyone feared Random, we defeated the best tribe on 39, that being ID, and embarrassed a premade you call "elite," that being Geico/PoP!

To be honest, it is not fair to compare V to Random today, but if you really want to, it would be hard to find arguments that support that V was better then Random.

 

[DeletedUser]

Hey Zeus, congratulations on leading the Rank 1 tribe on W39 first off. But let's face it, Random could and would beat your tribe. Random was one of the most talented tribes I have been apart of, the skill was off the charts. Your tribe was high in ranks, but didn't really do anything special when Random was around and on top. After Random left, your tribe gets Rank 1. That's not really an accomplishment.

If you read one of my original post on this thread, you will see that I actually said that. I am not trying to claim that we were better then Random, or any of the other tribes that were on that world. Merely that a tribe that early on people claim to be mass recruiting, can in the end, be a good tribe too.

To be honest, it is not fair to compare V to Random today, but if you really want to, it would be hard to find arguments that support that V was better then Random.

Again, I agree with the fact that all Elite tribes are overall more talented then those tribes who are assembled later on. I am just trying to make the point that sometimes some good tribes are put together that aren't considered Elite when the world begins.

 

[mattcurr]

If you read one of my original post on this thread, you will see that I actually said that. I am not trying to claim that we were better then Random, or any of the other tribes that were on that world. Merely that a tribe that early on people claim to be mass recruiting, can in the end, be a good tribe too.

My point if you have yet to figure it out is you have yet to prove you are good. Mere existence is not enough to be considered good.

Again, I agree with the fact that all Elite tribes are overall more talented then those tribes who are assembled later on. I am just trying to make the point that sometimes some good tribes are put together that aren't considered Elite when the world begins.

Again how can you consider your tribe to be a good tribe until it fights a real war? How?

Anyway Im off too lazy to keep repeating myself you still have yet to do something with your tribe other than exist, so until you can bring some tangibles this is quite pointless.

 

[DeletedUser]

My point if you have yet to figure it out is you have yet to prove you are good. Mere existence is not enough to be considered good.


Again how can you consider your tribe to be a good tribe until it fights a real war? How?

It feels as if you are continually asking the same question and I am continually giving the same answer. You have a different thesis of a good tribe then I do apparently. For me I think that when a tribe owns their area and becomes the #2 tribe on the world they have at least reached the qualification of 'good'. I think, at least hopefully, that we are on the same page on this.

You continue to say that we did not war a top tribe. I continue to say that we never had the chance. I think we proved through wars with those top 10 tribes that you mentioned, that we belonged in the discussion with the other top tribe of the world. If you feel otherwise, thats you opinion, and that is why this is a discussion thread.

Again, I know that we were not as talented/skilled as this Random. All I'm trying to say, one last time, is that tribes can be successful that aren't at the elite stage right when the world opens. I feel as if my tribe did this.

Anyway Im off too lazy to keep repeating myself you still have yet to do something with your tribe other than exist, so until you can bring some tangibles this is quite pointless.

Our tangibles as a tribe were never of elite status. I never said this. I think the problem is here that you are trying to group us into the standards held for those elite tribes, where I am stating accomplishments that are prominent to a tribe of a lesser quality.

 

[Michael Corleone.]

It feels as if you are continually asking the same question and I am continually giving the same answer. You have a different thesis of a good tribe then I do apparently. For me I think that when a tribe owns their area and becomes the #2 tribe on the world they have at least reached the qualification of 'good'. I think, at least hopefully, that we are on the same page on this.

You continue to say that we did not war a top tribe. I continue to say that we never had the chance. I think we proved through wars with those top 10 tribes that you mentioned, that we belonged in the discussion with the other top tribe of the world. If you feel otherwise, thats you opinion, and that is why this is a discussion thread.

Again, I know that we were not as talented/skilled as this Random. All I'm trying to say, one last time, is that tribes can be successful that aren't at the elite stage right when the world opens. I feel as if my tribe did this.

You had the chance to go to war with good tribes. You could've always gone to war with Random, but did you? No.

 

[DeletedUser]

As long as there are gamers and games like this that they play (that's not attempting to assert that your traditional 'gamer' is the only type of person to play tribalwars, because clearly they're not), there will be mass recruiting noobs, elitist pigs and everything else in between.

It just comes with the territory good or bad and I can't see it ending any time soon.

 

[DeletedUser]

Elitist pigs win. Full stop. No point having 150 members if only 5 of them can backtime. Even Schizo can backtime.

Schizo agrees with Schizo :icon_razz:

 

[zombie]

I have to mention that the rival tribe of Ouzo in w41 fell because of you. You started out your experienced career at w41, and when darkx got you to be diplomat, I disagreed with what he did and kept quiet. Then you messed up the tribe.

You are in no position to say that us, as a tribe, failed. You made us fail.

This ^

darkx today at 01:33
Hey mates, this is a circular message sent to all the former [ally]View[/ally] members, the players that left and the new players who have recently joined [ally]View[/ally].

For those of you who dont know me, I'm [player]Darkx[/player], the original founder and "exduke" of [ally]View[/ally].

The reasons of why I'm contacting you is to not bore you in anyway but to explain and apoligize for my misconduct and the sudden lost of [ally]View[/ally].

As most of you know, [ally]View[/ally] started off as a premade; tribe that was simple, no allies no big families, a premade mixed with both highly experienced players who have been successful in previous worlds and players with not so much experience but with the will to learn more and the activity needed to become a better player. Both types of players came to this tribe with high hopes of personal & tribal survival, both joining expecting to get something out of it. Some joined because when recruitment was open (before the world) beacause of who was leading it, others joined because of the success they seen [ally]View[/ally] accomplishing (even though the world was still young); growing at a rapid speed, in both points, ODA, & villages with a small amount of players, (not to say we also had former DNY members from w12 sharing the fun) who wouldn't?

Myself ([player]Darkx[/player]), [player]Zombie[/player], and the rest of the leaderships [player]rkddudgns[/player], [player]Templarz[/player], [player]tbolling[/player], [player]Eiodain[/player] have been thinking of some players on how to get the tribe alot better & expansion and plans on how to defeat the other tribes without any major loses. After some work, our thoughts put in some good ideas and they were supposed to be putting in effect sometime before the big lose. I guess I'm just trying to say, that I believe we had the best leaders for the job but some only desire to play as long as I do..

A huge lose has occured. I joined this world knowing that it was only going to be temporarly. I had to attention nor play to play this world for a long term retirement. Some of you know and others dont; I'm currently in the Navy, so playing this game for a long time was out of the question even if I tried. My activity indeed started off as very good as all others, but as time went by, so did real life. My time on tw has decreased, while my time in real life has greatly increased. I'm sorry but I had no choice but to put my real life time before TW time. Activity can either make a player or break a player and for me, it I was broken in 3000 pieces which also broke the tribe in the same amount if not more. Because of my inactivity, the tribe lacked leadership, and most only joined before they seen me leading. Players started to leave by the hour and the tribe started to crumble. This is another lesson to me, dont lead a tribe if you're not planning on leading for a long period of time. Though that is true, I also had a back up plan for this. I joined talking to others and potential players seeing which player would benefit [ally]View[/ally] the most in leading once I was gone, and I found some players though I didn't know them well enough to just give up the position for them. I think the; I guess I left sooner then I predicted my leave. I must thank those of you who stayed loyal to the tribe, and apoligize to both the ones who stayed, left and others who quit for my leave and most recent downfall of [ally]View[/ally]. Whatever you did, it was your choice and a choice you thought you could benefit most from. Because of me, alot of players now wont be able to enjoy their game (because they've already quitted) and because of what happened, we are now somewhat open targets.

Now I stand, my recent return to read unread messages and to see how the tribe itself was doing without me and to tell you the truth, thing's aren't as bad as I predicted.

The truth of the matter is, some of high expectations of us and our mates seen staying with this tribe as having the most competition because believe it or not, the most "elite" tribes here in K44 had their eyes on us since the first few days of the opening world. Both Ouzo & Ooops! seen us as the highest threats in the continent and knew they needed to take us out early before our expansion really started to grow. The level of experience others seen towards us was more then high, because of the players/leaders "previous achivements" it was only a matter of time before a gangbang was assembled or an internal downfall (which is what happened/along with my inactivity).

I'm sorry for not being all I could have been and what you have expected of me to be and I aplogize for not being there when I was needed most. I can promise you that this will not go down in vain. I'm not asking you to forgive me, just wanted to let you know what happened. I can only learn my mistakes and look towards a better/more brighter future. It's been fun playing with you all but some things just dont last..

No telling when, maybe later, maybe soon, but I will be back, to lead a tribe properly (as I know how) and to lead with the best activity rl can offer. And I promse to give tw hell one last time before I rid of this addiction. This is not a recruitment message, the purpose behind this message has already been stated. I would like to keep in touch with all of you to see how things are doing, ps I live to chat.

If you have any questions or comments, you can contact me on skype

skype: either darkmotox or darkmotox@yahoo.com

Thanks for reading this and hope I didn't waste too much of your time.

Account will be set for deletion in 48 hours.
[player]Darkx[/player]

 

[DeletedUser]

Just wondering why you posted this on World 1's general forum like 1 day after posting it here. Seems to me not a single person on world 1 is or gives a s*** about mass recruiting nubs. At least on that world. Pretty biased opinions you might get there no?

 

[Karmalot]

i don't think it matters what type of tribe you're in. Great players will be great regardless of their surroundings. Altough I prefer the elitist tribes over the mass recruiting.

 

[DeletedUser]

yeah me too.. i prefer quality before quantity..

 

[DeletedUser]

Elitist pigs are slightly less annoying than mass recruiting noobs. :icon_wink:

 

[DeletedUser]

Why does everyone think in terms of polarity.

The way most of you (by no means all of you) are speaking, one either has to be an elitist pig or a mass recruit tribe.
Its just like the democracy vs dictatorship issue in tribal leadership discussions on these boards.

Here, I'll even bold it for you :

THERE ARE MORE THAN TWO OPTIONS

I don't think I've ever seen a "Elitist Pig" tribe that actually had players one can consider elite in it.
Most elitist tribes are premades and have members who are slightly better than the average player. Thats about it.
Theres the irony of the matter, elite players almost never act "elitist" and and dislike the description of being elite.


As for mass recruiting tribes, thing is they do not have to be noobs.
I mean I think W8 clorox had about 350 members at a point. In todays terms people would term that as being a mass tribe (inspite of being within the tribe limit of that world). Yet, Clorox is one of the most feared tribes in the history of .net.

Also we should show some empathy for new players who gather together in large number for protection, thats just human instinct. 90 % of such players would abandon the habit if someone just took the time to explain the flaws of mass tribes to them.

The only real people you can criticize as regards mass tribes are experienced players who gather mass numbers of newer players amongst them just for security reasons and to get a steady supply of free villages.

 

[DeletedUser]

There are more then Two options. Honestly, I didn't know that a phrase "Elitist Pig" existed. Well, maybe my lack of knowledge.

I agree with Pervis on the statement:

"..., elite players almost never act "elitist" and and dislike the description of being elite."


I find the reason for this might be:
- People have some expectations from your Tribe
- People will have you under radar
- People will degrade you instantly as they'll see a report of you being cleared

This may inflict some amount of pressure on your Tribe and not everyone likes spotlight, even in games. Some rather grow quietly. That's why aliases exist.

Also, I think people are aware not all family / mass-recruiting Tribes are fail, but most of them are. Like chocolate Milka is ussualy really good chocolate - but sometimes you may get one with ugly taste (such as you may get one got family / mass-recruiting Tribe, but mostly they fail).


It is very very hard to discuss such matter as which fail - massrecruits / families and all over to elite Tribes.

I say:

Mass-recruiting can be Elite.
Elite Tribe can be a Mass-recruiting Tribe.

The problem is, mostly will dissagree with me, because the definitions of "Elite" here on TW Forums is different.
I think that "Elite Tribe" shouldn't be definied by number of members they have (like on Forums is expected a low count) or 20-30 known names in it. I think it's all about leadership.

You may have a Mass-recruiting Tribe, you may have a Family Tribe - as long as the leadership is good and organized.
It also depend on players in Tribe - that's why mass-recruiters ussualy rely on luck - meaning, if they get lucky, they'll recruit players who have some sense of play in a bigger Tribe.
Or, they'll recruit those who will leave later - however, then they will fall down to a lower member count, which is also a good thing.

 

[Fattybryce]

Hey pervis, been a while.

I think each has its plus and negitives. Though imo I would rather been in an "elite" tribe over a mass-recruit tribe.
In an "elite" tribe you know that person X can be trusted to attack whatever or defend whatever and work with other tribe members.
While in a mass-recruit tribe its not exactly certain that the person can do as required.

 

[Asylum Escapee]

well i have led a tribe before, and we were semi-elite, and when me and one of the baron quit, the tribe dissolved . probably didnt help that the one shitty guy that i let stay out of kindness and his activeness on the forums started making threads saying "were all going to die run away leave this tribe". i guesss i learned my lesson about noobs. i trained him, i helped him to play well, but he is still a bad player. when trouble came, he panicked.

 

[DeletedUser]

This is a very good OP. In the end, I think you present a more black-and-white view in your last part than is perhaps prudent (surely an elitist tribe willing to accept willing new blood is better than either extreme), but overall, neat topic.