i just want to point something out. I have watched visine from next door this entire world. They are well organized, they move fast, and no one sits inactive very long. Their diplomacy was great, their plans well thought out.. even some of their plants were well planted. Their team work is amazing, and i can understand everything king banana posted in that first page. I agree with all of it, and having lived it on w30 (that world was 4 years, not this 6 month beatdown i just watched) and pre P2W, these facts were more indelible. Visine has what i really wanted when i came back to tw at the beginning of world 104. kudos to you guys. Great machine you have built, Phoenx w30 envies your achievements here. Now... all of that being said. Nest.. you posted visine as one of the greatest tribes. To this i am forced to disagree. All of the best tribes are defined by the quality of the tribes that they have beaten. As bad ass as Visine actually is (and i know how difficult it is to build what you have) there hasnt been much competition to counter their greatness in any way. Every tribe has caved, either through politics, great recruiting, or just lack of response (burn). I honestly dont think you have found your enemy to truly define how good visine truly is on this world. Correct me if i am wrong, but i have thought this while watching the world this entire time. The recruitment of Trex pretty much sealed that deal, as Trex/babin would have been the best focal point of any resistance to Visine... And anyone's best chance to beat Visine. Balian.. shame on you for knowing this to be true, and allowing your tribe mates around you to be so lousy. If you want to beat Visine, you really need to gather your own group of ride or dies. Which.. if you have ride or dies now, i would say they are just dragging you down... Tribe first mentality is the only way to succeed here, and no one else has any of that. Too many selfish players. Anyways, this whole post could be a moot point as activity truly defines anything here. No one likes to defend, (myself included, tho time was more my enemy) and most people cave and dont log back in after the first round of nobles. (self included also) That seemed to be a common theme here, as players/tribes dropped like flies. The attrition is remarkable, as i recall it took months sometimes to remove the cockroaches we were aggressively attacking.. and most tribes burn out within a few short weeks/months now adays.. I guess that is just hte nature of the beast. no one makes the commitment anymore... Good luck to 104. Ill be poking around somewhat.. this would be my first true loss on tw. I didnt enjoy that part.