Where is RAM ?

Discussion in 'World 30' started by r2d3, Apr 13, 2011.

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  1. noobaxes

    noobaxes Guest

    We have a much different view of hugging. Quite frankly, I don't think Loen has any lesson for anyone on this particular topic.
     
  2. My thoughts on Phoenix Hugging, feel free to a) Give your view on what "Hugging" Entails b) What name you give to recruiting players from a tribe you are warring before said tribe has surrendered. c) Any other reasons you'd like to offer that dispel my assertion that Phoenix are hugging certain players to bulk out their points total.

    Well you haven't beaten them, because they haven't disbanded, so you can't term the players or the terroritory they control as the spoils of victory.
    Therefore one can only assume that seeing as you haven't beaten them you are hugging certain players by wooing them to join Phoenix, reason for this would be speculative, but assuming it's NOT because you wouldn't have eventualy beaten them, I think Phoenix would eventualy have beaten them, then the only other reason I can surmise is to bulk out Phoenixs total point count so that they are able to (eventualy) relegate BH to #2 ( BH 55 players 628 mill points versus Phoenix 26 Players 320 million points ) and declare themselves as a) outright winners or b) the senior partner in a winning coalition

    BH have limited expansion other than by conquering ( Close To Tribe Member Limit ) whereas Phoenix still have some 50% of the limit
     
  3. r2d3

    r2d3 Contributing Poster

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    LoEN 26 Players =

    52 players =

    a) WAR with BH or

    b) endgame


    I say ...

    [spoil]
    a)
    [/spoil]

    and if that is so, I probably get to drive once again :)

    (ok, back to farming :) )
     
  4. silvereclipes

    silvereclipes Contributing Poster

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    those that were invited seen they were doomed an understood to survive to the end game it was time to shallow their pride an ask nicely if they could join us,not that they were not being hit as well brnkmike was about to be hit when we were told to hold fire for now jonboy an NBD was hammered hard by us to which they understood they would be next on the removal list an was smart enough to come to us an ask to join to survive that much longer when they understood Karma an ship lead them down the primrose path to their doom! now when someone comes to us seeing the light as it were it shows us they were a bit smarter then the others an should be given a chance to show what they can bring to the tribe while others are still believing the BS ship an them gave them an are still fighting the lost cause if anything they make us smile at their craziness in thinking they stand a chance but we assign them their fate an tip a Axe to them for standing to the end even if it was dumb of them but who are we to tell someone how to play the game if they want to make a last stand so be it an let the TW gods smile upon them.
     
  5. So kinda like you took in rats from a sinking ship then, is that what you're saying? or would that be fleas fleeing from a shorn sheep?

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 15, 2012
  6. inflrc

    inflrc Still Going Strong

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    All your logical construction is based in a wrong assumption: "Well you haven't beaten them, because they haven't disbanded"

    If a duke of a losing tribe doesn't click the disband button, does it mean that they haven't lost? For me it means that they don't recognize their defeat. Almost all the meatshields they recruited have already been nobled, from GREEN times to MF times, many of their dukes have quit the game or resigned to go to other tribe, in the last months they are getting conquered more than what they conquer, they are mostly nobling inactive and barbs, they rarely organize any offensive raid, they are just defending and losing territory, one third of their tribe are inactive (even after recruiting new ppl), they have changed their name to try to change their "stigma", their current players don't want to assume the responsabilities for their "old" tribe ("dont the players left deserve a chance to overcome a stigma not created by them?"), etc.

    So, if they don't hit disband, what do we do? Noble all them? Their are still 3rd in the world and I only have 3 nobles left ...

    Or we move on?
     
  7. SO Phoenix now change their name to "The Borg" as you assimulate them, interesting concept
    [​IMG]
     
  8. noobaxes

    noobaxes Guest

    Those damn nobles. They keep running out. :(

    It's not uncommon for a winning tribe to recruit a few of a defeted tribe, or in this case almost defeated.

    No need to be bitter here M. Mike, it's probably not your fault if Loen is becoming irrelevant.
     
  9. But this is the whole point. Phoenix haven't defeated them they are recruiting them. Probably in part because of the difficulties with nobles keep running out, it's a fact everytime you noble an enemy village they gain a noble, whereas you have to produce yet another one. Admitidly easier now the prices are down but still a pain, but probably in part to bolster their points for when it comes to who gets the candy if Phoenix/BH get declared a winning combo
     
  10. S1cky Dutch

    S1cky Dutch Contributing Poster

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    Well if i didn't noble in 3 k's Hiram would have been gone long ago:p
     
  11. SnafuMaster

    SnafuMaster Guest

    Sir Mike,
    I do not wish to be rude or unforthcoming, but you are claiming we haven't defeated RAM. Yes, 'technically' they have not pressed the disband button. They have however already changed names, and not to mention the results are clearly obvious to anyone who is looking. If Phoenix as a tribe can produce the following result :

    Side 1:
    Tribes: Phoenx
    Side 2:
    Tribes: =H==G=, Drift

    Timeframe: Last 24 hours

    Total conquers against opposite side:

    Side 1: 129
    Side 2: 1
    Difference: 128



    Timeframe: Last week

    Total conquers against opposite side:

    Side 1: 577
    Side 2: 12
    Difference: 565



    Then I say that we won the war. And please keep in mind that those figures above are with us having to limit ourselves to the nobles we can recruit. I for one would be having at least 2 or 3 times more caps then I can now make.
    We're nobling more from RAM, then RAM is nobling externally, and RAM's #of points is rapidly shrinking.


    As for the recruiting. As everyone in Phoenix should know, that is our Duke who answers :). So I'll refrain from commenting.
     
  12. Realy thought you'd have seen the response to that one coming :icon_twisted:
    Side 1:

    Players: never back down, Jonboy920, bnkrmike24
    Side 2:
    Tribes: =H==G=

    Timeframe: Last 24 hours

    Total conquers against opposite side:

    Side 1: 48
    Side 2: 1
    Difference: 47

    [​IMG]

    Points value of total conquers against opposite side:

    Side 1: 458,283
    Side 2: 9,156
    Difference: 449,127

    [​IMG]





    Side 1:
    Players: never back down, Jonboy920, bnkrmike24
    Side 2:
    Tribes: =H==G=

    Timeframe: Last week

    Total conquers against opposite side:

    Side 1: 176
    Side 2: 5
    Difference: 171

    [​IMG]

    Points value of total conquers against opposite side:

    Side 1: 1,678,062
    Side 2: 46,456
    Difference: 1,631,606

    [​IMG]

    So the assertion that you are hugging players to finish the war ( maybe finishing it by ACTUALY defeating them was going to take too long! ) remains
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 16, 2012
  13. S1cky Dutch

    S1cky Dutch Contributing Poster

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    Bullmastiff


    24hours

    Total conquers:

    Side 1: 19
    Side 2: 52
    Difference: 33

    Total conquers against opposite side:

    Side 1: 16
    Side 2: 0
    Difference: 16


    last week

    Total conquers:

    Side 1: 65
    Side 2: 618
    Difference: 553

    Total conquers against opposite side:

    Side 1: 53
    Side 2: 0
    Difference: 53
    -----

    Maybe we should take a look at our other frontline players?

    So can't really call it hugging, as we are still gaining villages, and RAM or HG isn't nomore.
     

  14. There's no shame in admitting you're recruiting their players to help you win against the remainder, just the stigma that you're attaching to me calling it "Hugging".

    Now the fact is that using last weeks figures the members you hugged have accounted for 171 of your caps. Thats 171/565 of caps or just a tad over 30% of them, now as I've stated you would in all likelihood still be way up on caps but the figures are distorted because of your hugging players before you've defeated the tribe.

    The figures for the last 24 hours 47/128 or 36.7% capped by your huggees :lol:

    Will be watching these figures with great interest over the coming weeks, maybe Phoenix also needed some fresh blood to give impetus to the overall campaign?
     
  15. inflrc

    inflrc Still Going Strong

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    From an inside point of view, I can tell you that Phoenix motivation for recruitment isn't what you are suggesting. From an outside point of view, anyone can realize it easily just looking at our stats that the war is practically over. And, if you had kept an eye on the world evolution, you would know that RAM fate was decided when they decided to war many tribes at the same time, including BH and passed DECIDE.

    Recruiting just 3 members from a practically defeated tribe, can't be called hugging under any context, unless you want to refuse to see what is evident in which case you may have your own motivations.
     
  16. SnafuMaster

    SnafuMaster Guest


    Dude. We're pounding RAM in so many ways, and so many levels. And yes, our new recruitees have (i) orders to prove themselves on the offensive field and (ii) do not receive tribal support for their inaugural period. That's the way Phoenix works, you need to earn your position.
    Off course they are going to account for a certain % of our caps. Even if it would have been 10%, you would have used that to assert your above stated claim.


    Lets then use the following stats (who will only be very mildly distorted) :


    Side 1:
    Tribes: Phoenx
    Side 2:
    Tribes: =H==G=

    Timeframe: Last month
    Total conquers against opposite side:
    Side 1: 1,534
    Side 2: 41
    Difference: 1,493


    I think we can safely say the war is already over, and the mopping up action has begun.



    I do admit that you are right that nobling all of RAM villages would take a long time. They are still equally large then us on village count. But if you know Phoenix in any way, you would know that such a thing is NEVER any grounds for recruitment (I also refer to the above). We do not care about village count, only skill and merit. Everything else follows.

    Feel free to call it whatever you want. The only thing that matters to me (and the rest of Phx) is that we have 3 new players with us, who deserve their spot in Phoenix, and will greatly help in cleaning up RAM and all future endeavours.
     
  17. Serious First

    Serious First Well-Known Member

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    mind you one of them was duke xD.
     
  18. noobaxes

    noobaxes Guest

    I do agree generally with Phoenx guys and I really don't think they can be called a hugging tribe since they have fought lots of war in this world and haven't recruited much players while doing it.

    Recruiting some players in other tribes is not uncommon.

    However, I do not think Jonboy has proven himself a good fighter and he is certainly there because of points.
     
  19. Pajuno

    Pajuno Contributing Poster

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    Alright, sir mike.. since you insist...



    1. Stats Phoenx vs Ram forever:

    [spoil]Total conquers against opposite side:

    Side 1: 6,454
    Side 2: 3,067
    Difference: 3,387[/spoil]


    For the sake of argument, we wont touch the Drift/die/d2 stats, either.


    3300 villages we are up, and there is no relief in sight for Ram. The tribe is all but dead, minus a disbanding. The original accounts are no longer there. (shipley, karma, wittman, berns, tommy) Crasula, brown noser, and a whole host of other loudmouths present at the beginning, are no longer there.


    2. Phoenx leads the world in War Caps..> And we have had less than 25 players for much of that stat gathering time. You dare to call US huggers when we have the fewest roster changes, and most war caps per player than any tribe in w30 history??


    3. 3 players is not a Hugfest, mergefest, or anything of the sort. Bnkr and NBD have fought long and hard against us, and we have witnessed their activity, dedication, and raw skills needing to be honed. Why shouldnt i recruit the spoils of the longest war in w30 history???


    *side note for Noobaxes specifically*

    Jonboy is my recruit. Do NOT accuse me of recruiting for points, you should be above that by now. I have my own reasons, and they do NOT include points. ( i have already ordered the demo'ing of his village points)


    Now, lets look at the hypocrite, (sir mike) trying to sling insults and false assumptions all over the forums.

    Your tribe recruited ALL my food, from D2. Your tribe recruited Coach, also our food. You MASS recruited all those accounts, and it was all done for Points, Positioning, And to be used for supports. Do NOT apply your method of recruitment, to mine. I have a proven track record of being the stingiest at new recruits...

    How dare you compare your ineffective rabble, and its recruiting methods, to mine. If you persist in insisting that Phoenx "hugged" to finish the Ram war, i can easily Female Dog Smack you and your tribe to show you how nice our "hugs" are. Its up to you, Sir mike. if you continue, i will be forced to shut your mouth the only way left available to me. You have been refuted several times in this thread, and you still continue...



    Balls in your court.





    Pajuno Out.
     
  20. noobaxes

    noobaxes Guest

    Noted :)

    I have no issue with you recruiting him. I'm just not that much of a Jonboy fan but that is just a personal feeling. My view is just that he doesn't represent well the very aggressive nature of Phoenx.

    Whatever the reason you have for recruiting him, I'm totally fine with it. You're the Phoenx boss and you've been quite sucessful at it.