The beginning of the end of world 18

[DeletedUser]

Look at all the haters on here. LOL. First they said we would never last, we would never win, and now that weve shown we can and have, the haters come out of the wood works. Let me ask this, how many of you have reached end game? Thats what I thought. I dont think any one should be saying a damn thing unless they have been to the end, in which Im almost 100% certain very few of you have. I do find it amusing the whole members thing. Ohhh, you guys have 250 members, blah, blah blah. Not once do I see anything about the countless number of players removed by this mere 250 players, I know there were alot more payers here than 250, but I guess that does not amount to anything. Or how about the fact we were able to keep 250 member actively playing and striving for domination, how many of you can say that, probably not to many. (INSERT EXCUSE HERE) The thing all of you fail to realize is this was the plan from th start, this was not some big ploy to end the world, we made this happen, just as the founders planned from the beginning, and of course everyone doubted, everyone flamed us and now here we are. (INSERT EXSCUSE HERE) I bet had this have ended up with APOC losing all fo you would be singing the tune of "told you families never last" but since that cannot happen you all need to come with your ravenous BS(INSERT EXCUSE HERE). Do us a favor and get lost, we dont need you here, you had your chance to play this world, so wipe your tears and move on!

 

[DeletedUser]

An alliances are great as long as it serves a purpose and benefits both tribes. When they serve no purpose then you drop the alliance and battle it out. We were allied with FEMA for 2 years and through that alliance we formed some friendships and we helped each other out. But when the rest of the world was defeated we knew there could only be one winner, so we dropped the alliance and warred. It was not anything personal, this is just a game! A game where someone wins and someone loses. If Morthy does end this world APOC will be declared the winners, the rest will lose. I cannot imagine anyone being in those 3 other tribes that will be satisfied ending this world knowing that just their main tribe got declared winners.

But if this is what you guys want then enjoy.

That's the difference between us and you. We have never considered fighting our allies. Before we knew that the closing of a world was possible we were just going to mass delete. Our word actually means something. When we made the alliance it wasn't a temporary one, we made the alliance to last. Don't you think over almost 3 years every single tribe has tried to get us to fight each other? We've made it this far together, we will end it together. If that makes us "inferior" to other worlds, so be it. To me it makes us honorable. We refuse to betray our allies or the small players in our tribes just cause they no longer serve a purpose. We got here cause of their help, it's not right just to cut them lose afterwards.

 

[DeletedUser]

Let me ask this, how many of you have reached end game? Thats what I thought. I dont think any one should be saying a damn thing unless they have been to the end, in which Im almost 100% certain very few of you have.

/me raises his hand

and we defeated everyone!

That's the difference between us and you. We have never considered fighting our allies. Before we knew that the closing of a world was possible we were just going to mass delete. Our word actually means something. When we made the alliance it wasn't a temporary one, we made the alliance to last. Don't you think over almost 3 years every single tribe has tried to get us to fight each other? We've made it this far together, we will end it together. If that makes us "inferior" to other worlds, so be it. To me it makes us honorable. We refuse to betray our allies or the small players in our tribes just cause they no longer serve a purpose. We got here cause of their help, it's not right just to cut them lose afterwards.

Wake up!!!! This is a war game, not a test of your ethics. So you're the kind of person who plays against a friend and just lets them win because they are your friend? What fun is that?

We never betrayed our alliances, we were completely upfront with each other what would happen at the end of the world. This was a mutual agreement not one where we "betrayed" our alliances like you are suggesting.

If this is what you consider winning then enjoy.

 

[DeletedUser]

Wake up!!!! This is a war game, not a test of your ethics. So you're the kind of person who plays against a friend and just lets them win because they are your friend? What fun is that?

We never betrayed our alliances, we were completely upfront with each other what would happen at the end of the world. This was a mutual agreement not one where we "betrayed" our alliances like you are suggesting.

If this is what you consider winning then enjoy.

You played your world the way you wanted to and we played our world the way we wanted to. I really care less what you think or what you did. I concern myself with what has happened on this world.

We made a plan at the start of this world and we stuck to it. We beat all tribes in front of us. If you want to say because we had superior numbers so be it. We used our advantage to win the wars we fought.

Until you become someone who can decide when to shut down a world your words are very hollow. I am not meaning that in a disrespectful overture either. We did what we wanted and how we wanted and got what we wanted. That is all that matters.

 

[DeletedUser]

He's a forum mod for a different forum, and as entitled to his opinion as anyone, possibly more so since his tribe had to do it the long way, and now they're seeing you lot managing what seems like an easy way out. Also, I don't see how he's flaming, unless stating thoughts in reasonably respectful manner has suddenly been included in the definition of flaming.

Of course, I never modded forums, so maybe it has at that.

 

[DeletedUser]

He's a forum mod for a different forum, and as entitled to his opinion as anyone, possibly more so since his tribe had to do it the long way, and now they're seeing you lot managing what seems like an easy way out. Also, I don't see how he's flaming, unless stating thoughts in reasonably respectful manner has suddenly been included in the definition of flaming.

Of course, I never modded forums, so maybe it has at that.

There is a difference between opinion and engaging in a flame fest.

You sit there and think all you want how we did it the easy way and this and that.

In the mean time why don't you kill off that remaining 15% you have left. It might get you to end game faster. I am looking forward to your world being posted for closing so other worlds can come and flame you.

I have respected the opinions of those who have come in here and flamed us for playing our game the way we wanted to. The continued bashing of a world closing is a joke in itself. You see we did it the way we wanted. You played for 11 months earlier than we did and will play for at least another three more months. That is going to roughly be 14 more months it took you to close your world than ours. Stats can be made to look any way you want them.

The talk of your tribe not forming later in the game is not an issue. We made our friends within the first two months of this world opening. We had the plan to end the world how we wanted to end it. We did that. Your world should be the 3rd one to close. Your opinion is your tribe is better than ours, DNY thinks they are better than us and you. It is a matter of opinion and there is no need for insults. You came to our forum and insulted the way we played the game. Does it really matter? In your opinion it does. In ours it doesn't and in the mods opinion it doesn't. If you are so superior than us then act like it and let the thread go.

I have a 10 year old nephew who talks a lot of smack when he plays games. It sounds just like most of those who came here from your world. Not all of them have but most have. Arguing over who did this and who did that is very childish when you come to the world 18 forum and cry about your world not being closed before ours.

Bottom line is it is a game. Enjoy the next three months!!!

 

[DeletedUser]

Next world opening..3 tribes..Invite only..APOC vs DNY vs -WE-...

 

[DeletedUser]

An alliances are great as long as it serves a purpose and benefits both tribes. When they serve no purpose then you drop the alliance and battle it out.

I can't believe you actually wrote this in a thread in which an alliance as won its world. Define irony...

 

[DeletedUser]

Next world opening..3 tribes..Invite only..APOC vs DNY vs -WE-...

You know, that's a world I'd possibly come back to play. :icon_twisted:

 

[DeletedUser]

please, laz, don't give Andrew another statistical spankdown. i don't know if he can handle another

No fear. I was in Saudi Arabia and was bored. Back home now.

If I even suggest the possibility of creating another spreadsheet with w7 & w18 stats you have my permission to shoot me!

 

[Ray Joakim]

I am not sure how you became a moderator. A moderator is not supposed to get in a flame war which you have just entered. Maybe your moderator status should be removed with comments like you have made...but that is my opinion.

You played your world the way you wanted to and we played our world the way we wanted to. I really care less what you think or what you did. I concern myself with what has happened on this world.

We made a plan at the start of this world and we stuck to it. We beat all tribes in front of us. If you want to say because we had superior numbers so be it. We used our advantage to win the wars we fought.

Until you become someone who can decide when to shut down a world your words are very hollow. I am not meaning that in a disrespectful overture either. We did what we wanted and how we wanted and got what we wanted. That is all that matters.

Rednecks is not flaming whatsoever; he's expressing his opinion, and it's one alot of players share regarding family tribes. It's understandable that diminishing comments regarding family tribes winning in w18, because family tribes, are generally seen as a diminishing feature of the game; an easy way out. This i basically what the forum is for. Everyone is constantly rating and comparing - such as how APOC's feat match up to other worlds. It's only understandable. And while you find such comments to be "hollow", this hardly matters - for me, atleast, this discussion is to see what all the other people think about these recent events from various perspectives, and that's what I find interesting - someone who's never played this game may think w18 is an amazing achievement, but someone who knows about the stagnancy that family tribes create may think differently.

However, clearly comments on the forums have some effects - positive ones; talk with Morthy allowed for an endgame scenario - and negative ones: bad mouthing admin comments means delays. Forums, I'd imagine, give admins some perspective of what the players think; allowing them to see both sides of the coin. In a sense, Rednecks, in part, was someone who influenced when to shut down a world (world 12) as it was he and a few others who had conversations with Morthy in order to implement in endgame scenario in the first place. So of all players in TW, one could say that Rednecks has more influence over shutting down worlds then others - being the duke of the only tribe to win a world (as of yet), and a moderator to boot.

I can't believe you actually wrote this in a thread in which an alliance as won its world. Define irony...

I think you missed his point. Many earlier worlds could easily strike up an alliance and "win" the world. The point of alliance is to have someone watch your back while you fight an enemy. It becomes pointless when all that is left is the allied tribe. We believe that a world should be fought down to the last tribe standing; anything less would be a compromise between tribes to achieve an easy victory.

 

[DeletedUser]

The only reason bringing me back to this forum is to congratulate.

Congratulations to those still beeing here in the end !

Congratulations to the winners.

Head off for Apoc to play the game and proof it's possible to have a strong family despite the dislikement of other tribes.

It doenst matter how you play it, cause in the end only 2 things count in my opinion :

Those that won the games and those that got remembered !

Therefor i'm proud and salute you all.

Mentioning T~S (The Shadow) made me smile.

I came to this game, entered world 18, played it, enjoyed it and left when I felt I had to.
Afterworths, never touched it anymore, even it still stands in my top 3 favourites.

I can thank dozens of people for their help, war, friendship and flaming...but i'd forgot to many.
But in name of T~S and those once member of it, THANK YOU.

Farewell & good luck.

Slupmi
Proud Duke of T~S

 

[DeletedUser]

I think you missed his point. Many earlier worlds could easily strike up an alliance and "win" the world. The point of alliance is to have someone watch your back while you fight an enemy. It becomes pointless when all that is left is the allied tribe.

LOL! I missed the point?!?

I think I know why we set up the alliance - to end w18 as quickly as possible. We are on the brink of achieving that, as an alliance. Breaking the alliance would set us back. You, of course, by have your own reasons for setting up an alliance. But don't think you can talk for Apoc-BA, because you can't.

P.S. Did you understand my point? If not, look up irony.

P.P.S. I hope you never run for office!

anything less would be a compromise between tribes to achieve an easy victory.

Wow! So you almost got it. I absolutely agree with all but one of your words (if not your sentiment). Remove the word easy (because it wasn't) and we have consensus.

 

[DeletedUser]

Rednecks is not flaming whatsoever; he's expressing his opinion, and it's one alot of players share regarding family tribes.

I think that is the problem. In most competitive pursuits the "referee" should appear to be and behave as a neutral. Rednecks has clearly indicated that he isn't. "Bent" referees may be OK in your book but in mine there is no place for then in any competitive arena. I there are few thinks as competitive as the forums!

 

[Ray Joakim]

LOL! I missed the point?!?

I think I know why we set up the alliance - to end w18 as quickly as possible. We are on the brink of achieving that, as an alliance. Breaking the alliance would set us back. You, of course, by have your own reasons for setting up an alliance. But don't think you can talk for Apoc-BA, because you can't.

The point was: under me and Rednecks' understanding (and no doubt many other players), simply uniting the remaining players under one banner is not the purpose of an alliance -it can easily be percieved as an easy way out - just like being allied with everyone at the start of the world in protect your own ass. What Redneck's initially was talking about was the alliance's purpose. In our view, such an alliance this "winning" tribe is of little purpose, especially when there's still loads of players left. I never said I was talking for Apoc-BA. I was talking for Rednecks and myself and our opinion on this alliance to "win" the world. Of course breaking an alliance would set you back abit; but then you'd be able to actually win the world with a single tribe remaining, rather then several. Also, I said nothing about it not being ironic; indeed, from your point of view it is, but I see a clear difference between the purpose of alliances. Uniting a world to win it is not one of them.

Wow! So you almost got it. I absolutely agree with all but one of your words (if not your sentiment). Remove the word easy (because it wasn't) and we have consensus.

This world would never have closed if DNY's efforts to achieve an endgame scenario hadn't brought it about in the first place. And to do that, we had to finish the world with a single tribe remaining to get the attention of the admins. Argueably a harder victory - less players (61), and less tribes (just one, in fact), and from no help "assisting" tribes. Which, in relative terms, makes w18 an easy victory.

I think that is the problem. In most competitive pursuits the "referee" should appear to be and behave as a neutral. Rednecks has clearly indicated that he isn't. "Bent" referees may be OK in your book but in mine there is no place for then in any competitive arena. I there are few thinks as competitive as the forums!

You obviously don't quite exactly know how moderators in the TW forums operate. Moderators are allowed to give negative opinions rather then just appearing neutral in every topic. Moderators are required to be neutral when moderating the world's assigned to them, not for the entire forums.

And I should "never run for office"? What on earth is that supposed to mean, if not a personal flame? That's fine, I'll continue financial consultancy. :icon_neutral:

 

[DeletedUser]

This kind of nit picking, arguing over minutia, and bravado I have the biggest penis (or breasts not to offend the women out there) is why 90% of the top players stop reading the external forums.

Hats off to W12 for being closed. Amazing job, and the first to do it on .net.

Hats off to us for closing W18. Every world starts with a group of people that try and create family tribes, and they ALL fall apart. Over time, over months, over years they ALL fall apart. We havent. There are many and complicated reasons for that... but they call come down to the personnel running the tribes, the hard work and determination of those people, especially in converting the average player who is basically Player vs barb, to player vs players. This is something LACKING in even many old worlds, and something I am very proud of.

And hats off to W7, as from all intensive purposes it looks like you also will be closing your world.

We have all played different games. There is NO way to compare any of the 3 in my opinion.


If you dont know who I am look me up. Look at my villages per day, ODA per day, last time I nobled a barb village (Nov 2008) any marker you like. Call me a noob if you like for this being my first world. I can tell you now I have been playing computer games online and PvP for over 20 years... and the GREAT players train other players to greatness, lead tribes to greatness, and close worlds where noone else has before (in relation to family tribe doing it not first world closed ever)

Yes there are other ways to play. We chose large scale recruitment... it is a double edged sword and is NOT an easy path by any means. This was how we decided. We accomplished that... and now will go to bed smiling in our achievements.

Remember... on this world, just like every other world 80,000 players joined. We are but 300 left of those 80,000. Yes there may be only 50 that I consider GREAT players, but all 300 have got us to where we are. It is NOT easy running a tribe of 500-600 players... there are problems EVERY day, problems that normally result in destruction of the family. We overcame such things, and now have completed W18's history.



The most important thing i have to say is this:

Say positive things about your own game, your enemies game, other worlds and the game/admin as a whole. Bitching and complaining about things is not the way to win this game, other games, or any game I have played in the last 20 years.


Probably my last post here.

Zain
#1 World 18.

 

[DeletedUser]

It's easy because you're an idiot and simplified it to such an extent that you completely lost what I've talked about in the previous few posts.

Yeah - clearly I'm the idiot because I destroyed your arguments in a few lines. Stupid Andrew! Must not try to debate with empirically superior intellects!
(Just because you are a superior intellect I feel I better make it clear: Sarcasm!)

If you took your alliances 100 top players now and warred the rest of your alliance so that you were on roughly a similar field to -WE- in terms of % dominance vs rest of world then you wouldn't hit that pace and have your top 100 overtake our top 100 in an 11month timeframe.

If we were forced to win the world in the way *you* would like I have no doubt that we (our alliance) could work out a mechanism by which we might consolidate and the donors would turn over their villages willingly. When we had the problem with beginner (20:1) protection there was no shortage of volunteers to get nobled down to 1 village for the greater good. I can quite easily envisage similar selflessness if we were forced to do so.

Of course that scenario would never have happened because we had already committed to mass delete if the admins hadn't have accepted that we won this world together.

Fighting them doesn't mean ball licking and recruiting when 1 of your players goes inactive and you lose him. I realize this whole concept of war might be new to you, try playing some other world.

You are a bit up yourself aren't you!

I don't need to play another world. I have acquitted myself perfectly well on this one.

You must be such aggressive pros to have that amount of nobles stockpiled too.

You guys just love walking into these don't you...

Yes we are. The reason we have lots of nobles stockpiled is we have, for the most part, eliminated all our enemies (or whatever you call players that aren't on your side that stand between you and world victory).

 

[DeletedUser]

The point was: under me and Rednecks' understanding (and no doubt many other players), simply uniting the remaining players under one banner is not the purpose of an alliance -it can easily be percieved as an easy way out - just like being allied with everyone at the start of the world in protect your own ass.

That's fine but Redneck didn't present an "in my view" comment, he esentially *defined* the reason for an alliance and applied it to w18. In short he presented his opinion as fact, which it isn't.

In our view, such an alliance this "winning" tribe is of little purpose, especially when there's still loads of players left. I never said I was talking for Apoc-BA. I was talking for Rednecks and myself and our opinion on this alliance to "win" the world.

Fine. As long as we are presenting your opinion then feel free to express yours. And show me the same respect. In the end we have to agree to differ on what is acceptable and what is worthy of praise. I recognise that you may not have chosen to follow our game plan but we did and, in doing so, are on the cusp of not only being the second TW world to finish but also, by far, the quickest to do so. That was our aim and we achieved that. If you don't recognise anything else then you must recognise that.

Of course breaking an alliance would set you back abit; but then you'd be able to actually win the world with a single tribe remaining, rather then several.

This is the fundamental disconnect. Breaking the alliance wouldn't set us back a bit. I would completely go against our strategy and our morals & ethics. Winning through betraying (choose your own word) our friends would give us a far more hollow victory than the one we have achieved. I'm not only happy with how we got where we are, I am proud of it. If you don't get it then fine, I'm not doing this to be in your good graces.

Also, I said nothing about it not being ironic; indeed, from your point of view it is,

And that was the entire point of my post!

This world would never have closed if DNY's efforts to achieve an endgame scenario hadn't brought it about in the first place.

Do you really think yours was the only world that has been canvassing for a definition of what is required to end a world?!? Methinks you need a large dose of humility.

And to do that, we had to finish the world with a single tribe remaining to get the attention of the admins. Argueably a harder victory - less players (61), and less tribes (just one, in fact), and from no help "assisting" tribes. Which, in relative terms, makes w18 an easy victory.

I would argue that getting the admins to accept victory by an alliance was a lot tougher than getting them to accept it by a single tribe. After all, look at the shit Morthy has had to take in this thread. To his credit he was a lot more measured in his responses than I would have been!

You obviously don't quite exactly know how moderators in the TW forums operate. Moderators are allowed to give negative opinions rather then just appearing neutral in every topic. Moderators are required to be neutral when moderating the world's assigned to them, not for the entire forums.

I don't (nor do I care). I was simply expressing what my expectations are/were of a moderator.

And I should "never run for office"? What on earth is that supposed to mean, if not a personal flame?

Not at all. It was simply a response to your (projected) inability to see the world from others' perspectives.

That's fine, I'll continue financial consultancy. :icon_neutral:

Oh dear ;-)

 

[DeletedUser]

snip

I just want to point out that in this snipet you said you guys played your game the way you wanted to.
The game is not yours first of all, second of all everyone expects the game to be played the way it is intended to be played. Which is, by the way Innogames have things set up and explained, for 1 tribe to win a world and not 4 tribes.

This is why they made it a war game with a tribal limit.

With the win of this world it will change the history of TW and maybe even the way Innogames sets up its worlds and so forth. Because they can no longer make it seem like tribes need to win by being the only tribe remaining with all others defeated.

I also highly doubt anyone will come to world 7 and flame us when we close besides you people from w18 because some of w7 members flamed you. Other then that i think we will be congratulated for defeating all our enemies despite the fact that some people still remained out of -WE-s tribe. Like i said before..there are always survivors in a war and since this is a war game it should be no different..with few survivors with thier dead tribes that have already been defeated(because you defeat a tribe not a player thats why it is TRIBAL wars and not PLAYER wars) or 0 survivors and 1 remaining tribe.

 

[torflek]

Next world opening..3 tribes..Invite only..APOC vs DNY vs -WE-...

Mmmm... this would work if APOC was one tribe. As it is they are 4. Still -WE- or DNY would own APOC - 4 tribes or not.
:icon_razz: