The whole truth and nothing but the truth

[DeletedUser]

We never "planned" to make a supertribe. At the start, we only joked around about making such a tribe, since it'd be impossible to form it. We (Stalker, Formz, Mitsche and I) simply have too many friends that we'd like to bring. Hell, I'd like to bring at least 30 people from my tribe if such a thing were to be formed, which is impossible.

Honestly, Formz did never tell you the complete plan, and he was right in doing so. He told you parts of the truth, yes, but he also mentioned stuff like that. ChoCho is just one of our jokes. I told him to wait with the endgame details until we would be sure we could trust you. Looks like we were right in that.

Our true plan was to divide up the world and continue with neutral diplomacy. There'd be about 3 superpowers (One, Omen and the tribe Mitsche and Formz would form out of the active Apex and R4KI players) and a bunch of medium-sized tribes such as Fremen, SRA and TKEP. We'd also agree not to use spies or any other non-warlike tactics, just to provide for a fun and good endgame experience. Additionally, Formz was going to make a tribe under an anarcho-democratic system. Such a thing hasn't been done before and it'd be dang interesting to see if it'd work out.
As you can see, we did not plan to leave our tribes alone. Instead, we planned to create the ideal endgame: no spies, no dirty tactics, no allies, no size differences, but just pure war fun. Something like that could not be possible while Matt leads a tribe, as he utilizes such tactics all too well. This whole P&P is a dirty tactic to try and divide R4KI's opposition.

Honestly, you cannot expect the world to believe your crap. Stalker, Formz, Mitsche and I speak the truth and you cannot disprove us by quoting a Skype chat where Formz didn't tell you the whole deal. If you really think we would all abandon our friends, you're dead wrong pal.

All you've done or all you're doing is selling a story that has no... 'Je na se qua', for me, being anything to back it up. Even if it could be manipulated... I'm sure you have some where you are joking with your pals heartily... Right? ... Right?!

And I absolutely love how you're always making Matt out to look like the reincarnation of hitler and then there's you, shaping the perfect world. Seems kind of ironic to be honest.

Also I have to ask; why was this PnP a dirty tactic?

 

[DeletedUser]

:icon_rolleyes: your not bright I realize this, okay, but the fact that you may have been lieing, big shocker. Is irrelevant to my reaction to said offer. Do you understand that? Or do we need to break it down for you? That post was not about you.

What is relevant here is that you're trying to make it seem like One/GBKRM wants to exit this war because our plan would somehow be destroyed and that I am a liar, and therefor not to be trusted. I am here to counter that, because the last thing I'm going to allow is you spreading your filth on these forums.

1. One/GBKRM will not exit this war. I do plan to rid this world of your horrible leadership and so far we have been pretty succesful. K57/K47 is once again completely ours and K65 will follow quickly. We will purge this world of R4KI's inactives (because almost half of your tribe is flatlining... Pathetic) and create the base for the perfect endgame.

2. Our plan has not been destroyed. You have no clue who was into our plan. If you honestly think Formz would give 100% of the story to Simz, you'd sadly mistaken. We still have friends in R4KI and you still don't have a clue about what's going to happen.

3. Yes, I lied to you. So what? Formz lied to you. Mitsche lied to you. Stalker lied to you. Tom lied to you. You have probably already forgotten that you lied to me and Tom and that Simz lied to Formz this last week. You are lying to whole the world right now with this P&P. I bet you can see what my point is.

 

[DeletedUser]

All you've done or all you're doing is selling a story that has no... 'Je na se qua', for me, being anything to back it up. Even if it could be manipulated... I'm sure you have some where you are joking with your pals heartily... Right? ... Right?!

And I absolutely love how you're always making Matt out to look like the reincarnation of hitler and then there's you, shaping the perfect world. Seems kind of ironic to be honest.

Also I have to ask; why was this PnP a dirty tactic?

1. This P&P is a dirty tactic because R4KI is trying to break our tribes up from the inside instead of fighting us.

2. Matt's just an awful leader. It's not like he caused a worldwide catastrophe/tragedy.
However, we are indeed trying to create the perfect world. And the only thing between us and that ideal is Matt and R4KI.

3. Riiiiiight. Let's be honest here. Matt and Simz are bringing some story to the forums about 4 of the world's leaders trying to form one supertribe whereto they'll bring each two of their friends, after which they'll noble off the world. Our story on the other hand, is a viable alternative that would spark up this world: an equally divided world where the use of underhanded tactics is forbidden; the ideal endgame.
Honestly, I don't need proof to show people which option we were really working on.

 

[Muldie325]

If it were me I'd go for the super tribe. Fair playing fields are for fools.

 

[DeletedUser]

If it were me I'd go for the super tribe. Fair playing fields are for fools.

They want to create a perfect world, then they should have us. Coz we, the M&M's are perfect. :icon_wink:

 

[DeletedUser]

1. This P&P is a dirty tactic because R4KI is trying to break our tribes up from the inside instead of fighting us.

2. Matt's just an awful leader. It's not like he killed 6 million Jews. :/
However, we are indeed trying to create the perfect world. And the only thing between us and that ideal is Matt and R4KI.

3. Riiiiiight. Let's be honest here. Matt and Simz are bringing some story to the forums about 4 of the world's leaders trying to form one supertribe whereto they'll bring each two of their friends, after which they'll noble off the world. Our story on the other hand, is a viable alternative that would spark up this world: an equally divided world where the use of underhanded tactics is forbidden; the ideal endgame.
Honestly, I don't need proof to show people which option we were really working on.

I suppose I'll go for the number system too;

1.) We've said we'd rather fight you, we've said keep the attacks incoming, we've said... Actually you should've read what we've said before you post. Matt and Simz are merely informing your members of some information etc. If all this was to spark some kind of result, we all know that another (as you say) 'supertribe' would come out of it in which we'd still have to fight. So, please stop clutching that straw.

2+3.) Matt is an awesome leader, does he get pissy? Does he get frustrated? Does he expect only the best from the best? Of course, the guy is only human after all. Your 'story' to me sounds really deluded. I mean, agreeing to something and all participants actually obiding by it are two completely different things. A perfect end game with out any twists or turns is boring nevertheless... I know no one in this world would want that.

 

[DeletedUser]

I suppose I'll go for the number system too;

1.) We've said we'd rather fight you, we've said keep the attacks incoming, we've said... Actually you should've read what we've said before you post. Matt and Simz are merely informing your members of some information etc. If all this was to spark some kind of result, we all know that another (as you say) 'supertribe' would come out of it in which we'd still have to fight. So, please stop clutching that straw.

2+3.) Matt is an awesome leader, does he get pissy? Does he get frustrated? Does he expect only the best from the best? Of course, the guy is only human after all. Your 'story' to me sounds really deluded. I mean, agreeing to something and all participants actually obiding by it are two completely different things. A perfect end game with out any twists or turns is boring nevertheless... I know no one in this world would want that.

The number system is much easier indeed.

1. They are informing our members of info that doesn't even exist. It's a fact that we discarded the idea of forming a supertribe long ago. Heck, I've asked my members for input about how they'd like to see the future of W45 in my tribal forums. That should be proof enough to back up what I say. But by all means, believe the story Matt and Simz invented and "backed up" with Skype quotes conveniently pulled out of their context.

2. An awesome leader does not get his tribe declared war upon by multiple top 10 tribes. I have led lots of top 1 tribes before, and none of them (well, except Hentai in W13 at the very start of the world) got declared upon by multiple top tribes. If you are a good diplomat, you can avoid getting declared upon easily.
And sorry to tell you, but Stalker, Mitsche, Formz and I trust eachother completely. We have agreed to create a better world, and we shall do so, even if one part of our plan to destroy R4KI has been found out. Honestly, dismissing Formz and Angrim and exposing Matt's loyalists will only make this war easier for us. Yet again a completely foolish decision of an incompetent duke who doesn't plan ahead.

 

[Muldie325]

To add to my previous post, if I were intending to create a super tribe by splitting off from my tribe and joining up with rebels from a bunch of other tribes; I too would argue that my doing so is a completely ridiculous suggestion, it will never happen, of course my tribe can trust me. Because after all, if they found out, I'd be screwed.

 

[2hot2handle]

We never "planned" to make a supertribe. At the start, we only joked around about making such a tribe, since it'd be impossible to form it. We (Stalker, Formz, Mitsche and I) simply have too many friends that we'd like to bring. Hell, I'd like to bring at least 30 people from my tribe if such a thing were to be formed, which is impossible.

I have seen the convos , from people I totally trust , stating by formz his intentions to form this supertribe with 25 people only this week , without going into the logistics of whether it would work not , I have played a few worlds now with Matt and Simz and considered them both in my top 5 overall best players and leaders in this game and more than that they would never in a million years sell the rest of their tribe out.

I find it bizarre that people focus their energies of the fallacy of Matt being a Tyrant , yet ignore the fact that Formz has betrayed us .
I am astounded at Formz betrayal , I considered him a gentleman , never have I heard him in the chat or forum make any accusation against Matt or discuss any problems about the tribe . Yet it has been uncovered in the chats I have seen his issues and plans for the future , which ironically are Tyranical .

You really think you can trust him after what he has done , name me one thing I have done to make my tribe mate turn on me ... You attempt to discredit Matts leadership and yet you trust a backstabber who never once indicated he was unhappy within our tribe ?
He was in a position of responsibility in our tribe and betrayed us all , and you want to move on to make a perfect world with that as a foundation ?

Personally a perfect world for me is playing with people I know I can trust , I don't give two hoots how many tribes are gangbanging us ... That is what we play for !!!
This is the most exciting thing to happen on w45 , but I'd rather fight side by side with Matt as my leader to the very last village , than keep building villages for the next 3 years with people who scheme against their own tribe.

<3

 

[DeletedUser]

[random W45 lurker signing in]


this thread caught my eye, so I read it.

This idea of a super tribe reminds me of what we tried to do in W15. We had the number 1 tribe, and the number 3 tribe who were allies. As it was late game we were both suffering from inactivity, but were still in very commanding positions.

So we decided to create a 'super tribe' by merging our better active players, plus poaching some from other tribes. Needless to say it was a flop (lots of reasons why, mostly to do with planning but nevermind that)

there are so many factors at play when you look at something like this, which the R4ki people have pointed out. Those who get left out become more active and aggresive than ive ever seen, this tribe is the new world threat and thus really bring people against it, it can be easy to underestimate peoples loyalties to the tribe tag which they fought for.
I could go on and on about the problems we faced when forming this tribe, and yes we were the single best tribe, but we never got a chance to show it as from day one we had attacks from all directions at us.

Its a great idea on paper, in reality it simply doesnt stack up.
Plus, I still feel guilty to this day about putting people in a position where they had to choose between joining this new tribe and fighting ex-allies, or staying and fighting ex-tribemates.
Also remember, all players and potential leaders have a bit of a 'duty' to make the world interesting for all those that are involved in it. So dont do this lame merge sh*t. fight R4ki if you must, but then stay in your tribes and just fight each other/find new enemies. Its a far better path to choose

edit: to clarify the idea of this tribe was to essentially 'war the world' and in doing so the diplomacy situation got incredibly messy, and we ended up in war with ex-allies.
[lurker out]

 

[DeletedUser]

The number system is much easier indeed.

1. They are informing our members of info that doesn't even exist. It's a fact that we discarded the idea of forming a supertribe long ago. Heck, I've asked my members for input about how they'd like to see the future of W45 in my tribal forums. That should be proof enough to back up what I say. But by all means, believe the story Matt and Simz invented and "backed up" with Skype quotes conveniently pulled out of their context.

2. An awesome leader does not get his tribe declared war upon by multiple top 10 tribes. I have led lots of top 1 tribes before, and none of them (well, except Hentai in W13 at the very start of the world) got declared upon by multiple top tribes. If you are a good diplomat, you can avoid getting declared upon easily.
And sorry to tell you, but Stalker, Mitsche, Formz and I trust eachother completely. We have agreed to create a better world, and we shall do so, even if one part of our plan to destroy R4KI has been found out. Honestly, dismissing Formz and Angrim and exposing Matt's loyalists will only make this war easier for us. Yet again a completely foolish decision of an incompetent duke who doesn't plan ahead.

1.) I would absolutely love nothing more than for you to show and explain whats been 'pulled out of context' . This information obviously does exist, the fact that you are taking the time to defend your intentions so much shows there is something here. Please stop going back and forth between 'its been invented' and 'we dismissed it days/weeks', it obviously hasn't all been invented with 5 months in the working, if you're dismissing the idea... It's rather insulting. And plus I've never ever known Simz to lie about anything, ever since I've known him from 25, zilch. Whilst Matt may not command much respect on the forums (because of his personal persona), Simz sure as hell does because he's an honest guy (minus the ego Matt has).

2.) Which brings me on to my next point; an awesome leader can get declared on 'X' amount of tribes and pulls through it. I'm actually starting to think your 'perfect world' also includes peace and harmony in the brochure... Wouldn't surprise me to be honest. I'm sorry to tell you but I really couldn't care if you was inlaws, fact of it is one of you WILL betray the agreement with the chances being with a partner in crime in your group of 'perfectness'. How will it make it easier for you as now your spies have gone (the underhand tactic you really do hate so much :icon_rolleyes.

 

[DeletedUser]

I have seen the convos , from people I totally trust , stating by formz his intentions to form this supertribe with 25 people only this week , without going into the logistics of whether it would work not , I have played a few worlds now with Matt and Simz and considered them both in my top 5 overall best players and leaders in this game and more than that they would never in a million years sell the rest of their tribe out.

I find it bizarre that people focus their energies of the fallacy of Matt being a Tyrant , yet ignore the fact that Formz has betrayed us .
I am astounded at Formz betrayal , I considered him a gentleman , never have I heard him in the chat or forum make any accusation against Matt or discuss any problems about the tribe . Yet it has been uncovered in the chats I have seen his issues and plans for the future , which ironically are Tyranical .

You really think you can trust him after what he has done , name me one thing I have done to make my tribe mate turn on me ... You attempt to discredit Matts leadership and yet you trust a backstabber who never once indicated he was unhappy within our tribe ?
He was in a position of responsibility in our tribe and betrayed us all , and you want to move on to make a perfect world with that as a foundation ?

Personally a perfect world for me is playing with people I know I can trust , I don't give two hoots how many tribes are gangbanging us ... That is what we play for !!!
This is the most exciting thing to happen on w45 , but I'd rather fight side by side with Matt as my leader to the very last village , than keep building villages for the next 3 years with people who scheme against their own tribe.

<3

I've got to know Formz pretty well these last 2 months, so I trust him for 100%. He actually talked a lot with other people inside R4KI about Matt and most people admitted to him that they grew tired of his temper tantrums and non-democratical form of leading.

But to be honest, I'll let Formz answer this one. He'll know it better than me and he should post here soon.

 

[DeletedUser]

doesnt the words "the idea has been dismissed" have no meaning o you guys? lets just say HYPOTHETICALLY, A super tribe is to be created, but like most players stated here, there'd be lots and lots of complications that im sure Dae, Stalk, Tom or any leaders wont foresee. With that thought at hand it will be way fun with a world of Actual competition.

So whats more to say. Even if the plan existed i doubt that any of the leaders would jump into it, its just plain reckless. No leader or decent Logical man (in my opinion) would leave his/her sanity for a dominance that wont be assured to work.

 

[2hot2handle]

I've got to know Formz pretty well these last 2 months, so I trust him for 100%. He actually talked a lot with other people inside R4KI about Matt and most people admitted to him that they grew tired of his temper tantrums and non-democratical form of leading.

But to be honest, I'll let Formz answer this one. He'll know it better than me and he should post here soon.

I'm sorry but I have been in R4ki from the very begining and never heard ANYONE complain about Matt , on this level ,and I claim to be the most vocal , approachable person in the tribe ! :icon_eek:
I genuinely have no idea what non-democratical form of leading you are going on about . No-one is 100 % perfect as a leader and everyone as their own ways .
In my opinion , if you don't like the leadership LEAVE the bloody tribe don't betray people who trust you and respect you in such a disgraceful manner.

Daethon you know nothing about Matt's leadership from the inside .. you trust someone 100% who has just betrayed his own tribe members , that says a lot about your credibility.

I laugh at the idea of Matt being a tyrant , I've wound him up like you wouldn't believe ... but I always get round him in the end

but you are right Formz should answer .. I'm fascinated to see how he can justify this.
He came across to me as a very genuine individual even concerned about my RL situation ... I'm saddened by his actions.

<3

 

[DeletedUser]

If matt's such a horrid leader, then how come most of the top tribes in the world need to band together to get rid of him ?
That argument is a head in the sand joke made by a bunch of people who got caught in the act of trying to sell their tribemates out and are scrabbling desperately to cover for it.

Lots of text
[spoil]They don't. The second part just seemed to prompt an explanation from me.


Of course


I never said you guys were making it up. I just said that its a possibility that its being framed differently. Like I said before, its entirely possible (not necessarily true) that Omen and One leaderships were just leading Formz on for their own entertainment.

If the top member of the most dominant tribe in the world came to you when you were an outsider, wouldn't you go along with anything he said if it could have lead to troubles within that tribe, even if you didn't really plan to follow through? Even now we are starting to see the results. Formz has been kicked from R4KI, and now it seems that no one trusts him.


Obviously not, although that'd be pretty impressive if you guys did. Like said above, I just think that this can be looked at in different ways.


I remain unconvinced of all perspectives on this subject. On one side we have R4KI saying that the leaders of Omen and One were planning to leave their tribes behind for this super tribe with R4KI members. On the other we have the Omen and One leaders vehemently denying this. It all comes down to he said/she said, which is not proof in itself. Even the skype conversation on the front isn't concrete proof. There's a difference between what is said, and what is intended.

And I'm not saying R4KI is lying. Even if your perspective turns out to be the false one, I would say you guys lied. Hundreds of years ago, the majority of people thought the Earth was flat and that the Earth was the center of our solar system. Obviously they were proven wrong. That doesn't mean those people in the past were all liars. It means that they lacked information and made the best assumption that they could. The same thing applies here. Both sides are plausible, but with a lack of evidence at the time, neither can be proven.


Well this conversation started by showing that Formz had not only betrayed R4KI, but also those that he had conspired with. It's already been shown that he hasn't been true to anyone. I figured that this went without saying, and that making it a part of my posts would have been redundant, so I left it out originally.[/spoil]

So basically we agree on everything except for the stuff that we have already agreed to disagree on. Why are we still talking ?

 

[DeletedUser]

I've got to know Formz pretty well these last 2 months, so I trust him for 100%. He actually talked a lot with other people inside R4KI about Matt and most people admitted to him that they grew tired of his temper tantrums and non-democratical form of leading.

But to be honest, I'll let Formz answer this one. He'll know it better than me and he should post here soon.

Can you name those people under matt leadership who admitted that they are tired of how matt leading? :icon_rolleyes:

 

[DeletedUser]

We never "planned" to make a supertribe. At the start, we only joked around about making such a tribe, since it'd be impossible to form it. We (Stalker, Formz, Mitsche and I) simply have too many friends that we'd like to bring. Hell, I'd like to bring at least 30 people from my tribe if such a thing were to be formed, which is impossible.

Honestly, Formz did never tell you the complete plan, and he was right in doing so. He told you parts of the truth, yes, but he also mentioned stuff like that. ChoCho is just one of our jokes. I told him to wait with the endgame details until we would be sure we could trust you. Looks like we were right in that.

Our true plan was to divide up the world and continue with neutral diplomacy. There'd be about 3 superpowers (One, Omen and the tribe Mitsche and Formz would form out of the active Apex and R4KI players) and a bunch of medium-sized tribes such as Fremen, SRA and TKEP. We'd also agree not to use spies or any other non-warlike tactics, just to provide for a fun and good endgame experience. Additionally, Formz was going to make a tribe under an anarcho-democratic system. Such a thing hasn't been done before and it'd be dang interesting to see if it'd work out.
As you can see, we did not plan to leave our tribes alone. Instead, we planned to create the ideal endgame: no spies, no dirty tactics, no allies, no size differences, but just pure war fun. Something like that could not be possible while Matt leads a tribe, as he utilizes such tactics all too well. This whole P&P is a dirty tactic to try and divide R4KI's opposition.

Honestly, you cannot expect the world to believe your crap. Stalker, Formz, Mitsche and I speak the truth and you cannot disprove us by quoting a Skype chat where Formz didn't tell you the whole deal. If you really think we would all abandon our friends, you're dead wrong pal.

Should be easy to provide the screen shots where you are clearly joking about this as opposed to planning this, and screen shots of the "real" plan:icon_rolleyes:

 

[DeletedUser]

Should be easy to provide the screen shots where you are clearly joking about this as opposed to planning this, and screen shots of the "real" plan:icon_rolleyes:

mmm remember to put the correct dates on the "joking" screenshots.

 

[DeletedUser86073]

Alls fair in love and war, w45 has at last become interesting

 

[DeletedUser]

Alls fair in love and war, w45 has at last become interesting

incomings ?