God Vs Darwin.

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DeletedUser

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pyker42 said:
You are ignoring the concept of pack mentality. When the lionesses bring a kill back for the pride, your assumption would be, that based on survival, they would eat first, correct? In actuality, though, the males eat first. This is because of the societal hierarchy that is embedded in their nature. It is the same way for humans. We often put the concerns of the whole over the concerns of the individual. In fact, that is the basis of civilization, for if we were not capable of doing that we wouldn't exist as we do today. It is our pack animal heritage that creates this mentality that is now manifested in what we call "morals."


As the world grows closer and into one "tribe" this type of mentality will diminish. However, pack mentality doesn't mean that we put the preservation of other packs ahead of ourselves. We are concerned with our own pack.
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I'm not talking about situations where survival is not in question. If the lionesses are starving when they make the kill are they going to bring the males to it to eat 1st? I would think not. And your saying that we have morales because we need to work together but I have a question for you. What does morales have to do with working together? Do I need morales to make a project with someone? What morales would even be used when it comes to working together? Its not like you could steal the project cause the teacher would know its both of yours. You gonna be urged to kill the guy to take all the credit? In a pack I don't think you would be taking food from the other people who helped kill the prey cause then you would be taking food from yourself seeing as you would need help from the other members of you clan / tribe / family to take down prey in the 1st place...to me morales seem rather pointless when it comes to teamwork. Call me a barbarian :icon_twisted: but hey, thats my opinion.

pyker42 said:
In regards to your example, no, "morals" would not stop them. You know why? The survival of their pack (the French) far outweighs the survival of the the other pack (the Spanish), therefore, their morals will be counter acted by the need for survival of their group. Of course, it is the French we are talking about, so they might just instead surrender to the Spanish and hope for the best. :lol:
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I'm not saying that the French wouldn't do it...or rather wouldn't surrender instead :lol: I'm saying that they would still feel bad about doing it.

And don't worry about the bio, I'm sure someone will else will try and pick a fight with me about that :icon_wink:

Now, I must be off...may not reply for a couple days...or even a week or so because of Christmas plans :icon_razz:
 

DeletedUser

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ristow said:
OUr grandchildren shall be giants.:icon_eek:
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Recent change in human size is due to an increase in the nutrients the average person receives in their diet...no evolution there...sorry :icon_cry:
 

DeletedUser

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MESIBA said:
I'm not talking about situations where survival is not in question. If the lionesses are starving when they make the kill are they going to bring the males to it to eat 1st? I would think not. And your saying that we have morales because we need to work together but I have a question for you. What does morales have to do with working together? Do I need morales to make a project with someone? What morales would even be used when it comes to working together? Its not like you could steal the project cause the teacher would know its both of yours. You gonna be urged to kill the guy to take all the credit? In a pack I don't think you would be taking food from the other people who helped kill the prey cause then you would be taking food from yourself seeing as you would need help from the other members of you clan / tribe / family to take down prey in the 1st place...to me morales seem rather pointless when it comes to teamwork. Call me a barbarian :icon_twisted: but hey, thats my opinion.
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Yes, actually they would. Because that is how a pride works. If the lionesses are starving, then all the pride are starving.

What you described is exactly what I am talking about. If you don't understand the concept of how societal constraints, aka, morals, plays a part in working and living together as a human being, then there isn't much I can help you with. Suffice it to say, working together equaled survival for everyone, and as such, a certain mentality was born of that need to work together to survive. That mentality has grown into the complex things we call morals. Modern morals are not the same as the "morals" of the nomadic hunter gatherers of early human existence, but evolutions of the basic mentality, just as we are the evolution of those early humans.



MESIBA said:
I'm not saying that the French wouldn't do it...or rather wouldn't surrender instead :lol: I'm saying that they would still feel bad about doing it.
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I doubt they would feel very bad about it. Some individuals might, but as a society, they wouldn't.

MESIBA said:
And don't worry about the bio, I'm sure someone will else will try and pick a fight with me about that :icon_wink:

Now, I must be off...may not reply for a couple days...or even a week or so because of Christmas plans :icon_razz:
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Ohh, a week to give you a really stellar argument as to why you are wrong. :lol:
 

darkaniken2

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MESIBA said:
Recent change in human size is due to an increase in the nutrients the average person receives in their diet...no evolution there...sorry :icon_cry:
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And how do you think humans figured out that consuming those was a good idea?
 

DeletedUser

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Your in luck, I've still got time :icon_twisted:

pyker42 said:
Yes, actually they would. Because that is how a pride works. If the lionesses are starving, then all the pride are starving.

What you described is exactly what I am talking about. If you don't understand the concept of how societal constraints, aka, morals, plays a part in working and living together as a human being, then there isn't much I can help you with. Suffice it to say, working together equaled survival for everyone, and as such, a certain mentality was born of that need to work together to survive. That mentality has grown into the complex things we call morals. Modern morals are not the same as the "morals" of the nomadic hunter gatherers of early human existence, but evolutions of the basic mentality, just as we are the evolution of those early humans.
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I find it hard to believe that a pride would do that...cause if they are going to die if they don't eat then there is no way for them to transport the stuff back to the other lions. Dead lioness = no food :icon_cry: Tell you what, find an article about lionesses dying of hunger after they killed the prey and they were in the process of transporting the goodies back that is written by a credible scientist / biologist and I'll believe you about the lions :) You seem to have gotten that info from somewhere so please cough it up :icon_razz:

and you still haven't answered my question...what part of morales have to do with working together? All your sayings is that they do but not saying why or how.

pyker42 said:
I doubt they would feel very bad about it. Some individuals might, but as a society, they wouldn't.
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Societies don't feel...but the individuals would still feel bad about stealing the filters...I'm pretty sure about that...unless of course you were just heartless :icon_twisted:

darkaniken2 said:
And how do you think humans figured out that consuming those was a good idea?
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Is eating poisonous mushrooms good for you? No, its multiple guess :lol: but in the end they found stuff that did certain good things and lately we've researched these things and named them and now we can eat better then we did before...back in the medieval ages you were lucky if you ate meat once a week...we eat meat every day cause we know its good for us, or atleast parts of it are usefull :icon_razz:

...and now maybe I'll be gone o_O who knows...I may pop up sometime :icon_cool:
 

darkaniken2

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Yes, but how do we figure things out? People in the middle ages weren't stupid. They just didn't know things. So what caused us to figure it out?
 

DeletedUser

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darkaniken2 said:
Yes, but how do we figure things out? People in the middle ages weren't stupid. They just didn't know things. So what caused us to figure it out?
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You expect me to know what triggered our interest? This is a phrase that I learned in physics...most things are discovered when someone goes "I wonder if" and tries it.

and while we are on about how did they come up with that...where did we get the idea to milk cows? did we just go hey look ! mmm...well the baby drinks from the mother so why can't I drink from the cow :icon_eek: Truth is we don't know, we can only guess how they came up with the idea :icon_cool: ...btw, I could have made this so dirty but I fears the infraction :icon_confused:
 

DeletedUser

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MESIBA said:
I find it hard to believe that a pride would do that...cause if they are going to die if they don't eat then there is no way for them to transport the stuff back to the other lions. Dead lioness = no food :icon_cry: Tell you what, find an article about lionesses dying of hunger after they killed the prey and they were in the process of transporting the goodies back that is written by a credible scientist / biologist and I'll believe you about the lions :) You seem to have gotten that info from somewhere so please cough it up :icon_razz:
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What, you want me to post evidence? lmao, you have made supposition after supposition with nothing to back it up. Mine, however, is backed up from years of watching the Discovery Channel. :lol:

They don't drag their kills back, as often their kills are too large for that, but they eat the kill where it was felled. And the head male always eats first. Even though he never partakes in the hunts.


MESIBA said:
and you still haven't answered my question...what part of morales have to do with working together? All your sayings is that they do but not saying why or how.
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Yes, actually I did answer your question. You just don't seem to understand this concept. Pack mentality evolved into modern morals as civilization evolved.

MESIBA said:
Societies don't feel...but the individuals would still feel bad about stealing the filters...I'm pretty sure about that...unless of course you were just heartless :icon_twisted:
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If societies didn't feel, then laws would not exist.
 

nathaniak

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The lioness would let the males eat first. BUT the males are better at fighting, and they will protect the tribe as a whole
 

DeletedUser

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darkaniken2 said:
Yes, but how do we figure things out? People in the middle ages weren't stupid. They just didn't know things. So what caused us to figure it out?
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I actually saw a documentry about that a while ago on discovery channel.

The theory goes something like this (cant remember all of it so exuse me if i get some facts wrong) It is also just a theory.

Our apish ancentor as we werent what we would call human yet was walking around and came across en thermite hill. The thermites fellt threatened by the presence of our ancestor and attacked. Our ancestor defended himsellf the best he could. In his efforts to get away and get the pesty buggers of him he some how got some in his mouth and well ate them.

The taste of these creatures was appeeling so they started to think about ways to eate them. One of them came up with the brilliant idea of taking a stick and poking in the termite hill and just eate the termites who walked on the stick. The protein of these termites was the trigger of thinking. As the the proteins where the essential part that our brains needed to evolve.

And some where along the way they thought of other creatures they could trap and eat and this eventuelly leads to us discussing it ;)
 

darkaniken2

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panic manic said:
I actually saw a documentry about that a while ago on discovery channel.

The theory goes something like this (cant remember all of it so exuse me if i get some facts wrong) It is also just a theory.

Our apish ancentor as we werent what we would call human yet was walking around and came across en thermite hill. The thermites fellt threatened by the presence of our ancestor and attacked. Our ancestor defended himsellf the best he could. In his efforts to get away and get the pesty buggers of him he some how got some in his mouth and well ate them.

The taste of these creatures was appeeling so they started to think about ways to eate them. One of them came up with the brilliant idea of taking a stick and poking in the termite hill and just eate the termites who walked on the stick. The protein of these termites was the trigger of thinking. As the the proteins where the essential part that our brains needed to evolve.

And some where along the way they thought of other creatures they could trap and eat and this eventuelly leads to us discussing it ;)
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Thank you for making my argument for me. :)
 

DeletedUser

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Here's a theory...

Evolution and god are both real :D

God made evolution ;)

Problem solved.
 

DeletedUser

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Well, I am god...

And I was created by nobody...

Btw...you're going to hell for saying you created me -.-

I will not forgive either :/
 

DeletedUser

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xB00MxHEADSHOTx said:
Well, I am god...

And I was created by nobody...

Btw...you're going to hell for saying you created me -.-

I will not forgive either :/
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Hell sounds fine with me. And purly scientificly speaking god must have been created by something. Forces cant be created out of nothing. So either god doesnt exsist or god has a god of it own
 

DeletedUser

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That is the problem with you humans.

I have always been here and always will be, I was not created and I can't be destroyed.

But humans can't imagine something that never ends.

Well you mortals better start thinking outside of the box if you ever want to tap into those powers I had stored away in your brains.
 
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