God Vs Darwin.

[DeletedUser]

You created god? And god created the earth, inclusive you. Paradox?

Ah, one of my shining angels, you should know better than to believe he created me :/

 

[tomas torquemada]

to get back on track this topic is a great deal simpler than people make it.

Darwin's premise is that life is but a serious of mistakes or evolutions that push us down a road and there is no devine intent.

God is seen as an omnipotent being that created all and decides all.

so as to is it or isnt it god .......

The basic fact is ......God can never ever be proved !!!! ig god does not exists there will never be proof, if he does god will do what ever it takes to put doubt in the mind of man to ensure you believe in him/her through faith alone.

Religion is MAN MADE and ths flawed, all religion is flawed. to give a physical representation of religion lets imagine one representative from each religion sitting in a cirle in the saraha desert each with a handful of sand. the sand represents the truth of life, each holds up their handful and says this is the truth of god....... who is correct. as a species we will learn through our mistakes but we are still children on the path, when we no longer kill each other for fun or in the name of their god then those sitting in the cirle may look at one another and finally realise none of them truly hold the truth, all of them do and then and only then will we have taken the first step.

so we may find many theories as to what created everything and how and why and everything we find proving or disproving god / darwin may or may not have been placed their by a higher existence as part of the path we take.

this may be way to heavy reading but its a heavy subject.

TT

 

[DeletedUser]

to get back on track this topic is a great deal simpler than people make it.

Darwin's premise is that life is but a serious of mistakes or evolutions that push us down a road and there is no devine intent.

God is seen as an omnipotent being that created all and decides all.

so as to is it or isnt it god .......

The basic fact is ......God can never ever be proved !!!! ig god does not exists there will never be proof, if he does god will do what ever it takes to put doubt in the mind of man to ensure you believe in him/her through faith alone.

Religion is MAN MADE and ths flawed, all religion is flawed. to give a physical representation of religion lets imagine one representative from each religion sitting in a cirle in the saraha desert each with a handful of sand. the sand represents the truth of life, each holds up their handful and says this is the truth of god....... who is correct. as a species we will learn through our mistakes but we are still children on the path, when we no longer kill each other for fun or in the name of their god then those sitting in the cirle may look at one another and finally realise none of them truly hold the truth, all of them do and then and only then will we have taken the first step.

so we may find many theories as to what created everything and how and why and everything we find proving or disproving god / darwin may or may not have been placed their by a higher existence as part of the path we take.

this may be way to heavy reading but its a heavy subject.

TT

And this is exactly how i see it too

 

[Overvoltage]

so I really only felt like reading the first post, and I decided to comment on just it

Now, a few facts... i will take christianity as an example, as it is the biggest religion of the world.

it's not anymore, islam is the largest religion by population

***As we all know, the current count of years originate from jezus his birth.

However, it took 1500 years to write the entire bible, the old testament was done 400 years before christ, and the new testament 100 years after christ.

It was written by more then 40 people...

However, the bible still is 1 unit... fits perfectly...

If 40 of us go and write a story in 2 months, we have so many contradictions already, that unless we work together to the letter, it would be impossible to do...

there are sections of the bible that never made it into the new testament; the stories didn't allign, so they didn't use them, it wasn't some magic recollection
also, we might get the year from that, but our days are from norse religions
(moon's day, tyr's day, woden's day, thor's day, freyja's day, saturn's day, sun's day)

While there is absolutely no single shred of evidence for that... and if he would exist, why not show himself to us...
Why hide... why let the religion shrink and die in some parts of the world... why let bad things happen?

there actually is something...
1st corrinthians 15:3-8, jesus proved his resurrection by appearing to people
matt 18:19-20, jesus is here, god does anything we ask
so jesus is already here, it would be trivial for him to appear, but it's ok to if we ask it of him
so get some buddies, and ask him to physically appear so you know he's resurrected
just something like
"dear jesus, we know you are here in our midst already, we ask you to physically appear so that we know you are resurrected. we have faith that you will answer our prayer as you promised in the bible, in your name we pray, amen."

...and nothing happens

Now enough about god...
On to darwin...

Evolution theory...
Do we come from the apes...
Do we originate from one celled organismes?

itt: people who don't know what Darwin's theory of evolution is...

If so, then why are we the only species capable of talking, inventing, science... development...
We drive cars, live indoors, with all luxery...

and yet, when man seeks and is made unhappy with what he finds, still he seeks more. I will never understand why.

If we assume his theory is true, we were weak beings when evolving to what we are now..
So why werent we killed completely by predators?
Why are we still here?
Why is it that NO other species in the world is even close to being capable of what we can?

actually, several species of homosapian were wiped out throughout history, they each had their own unique physical identifications, but in most cases it was a lack of inventing tools

 

[DeletedUser26129]

so I really only felt like reading the first post, and I decided to comment on just it


it's not anymore, islam is the largest religion by population

Wrong:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Major_religious_groups

[SPOIL]Religious category Number of followers Cultural tradition Main regions covered
Christianity 2,100,000,000 – 2,200,000,000[6][7] Abrahamic religions Predominant in the Western world (Europe, the Americas, Oceania), Sub-Saharan Africa and the Philippines. Minorities worldwide, see Christianity by country.
Islam 1,300,000,000 – 1,600,000,000[8][9] Abrahamic religions Middle East, Northern Africa, Central Asia, South Asia, Western Africa, Indian subcontinent, Malay Archipelago with large population centers existing in Eastern Africa, Balkan Peninsula, Russia, Europe and China.[/SPOIL]

there are sections of the bible that never made it into the new testament; the stories didn't allign, so they didn't use them, it wasn't some magic recollection
also, we might get the year from that, but our days are from norse religions
(moon's day, tyr's day, woden's day, thor's day, freyja's day, saturn's day, sun's day)

And this is relevant why?

there actually is something...
1st corrinthians 15:3-8, jesus proved his resurrection by appearing to people
matt 18:19-20, jesus is here, god does anything we ask
so jesus is already here, it would be trivial for him to appear, but it's ok to if we ask it of him
so get some buddies, and ask him to physically appear so you know he's resurrected
just something like
"dear jesus, we know you are here in our midst already, we ask you to physically appear so that we know you are resurrected. we have faith that you will answer our prayer as you promised in the bible, in your name we pray, amen."

...and nothing happens

Again thats written, not proof imo...

itt: people who don't know what Darwin's theory of evolution is...

I actualy do know it as i studied it, however i simplyfied it....

actually, several species of homosapian were wiped out throughout history, they each had their own unique physical identifications, but in most cases it was a lack of inventing tools

I am aware of that, however you already awnsered it yoruself... they lacked to do what we are able to do.

 

[DeletedUser]

there are sections of the bible that never made it into the new testament; the stories didn't allign, so they didn't use them, it wasn't some magic recollection
also, we might get the year from that, but our days are from norse religions
(moon's day, tyr's day, woden's day, thor's day, freyja's day, saturn's day, sun's day)

Tell me, if the stories are not in the New Testament(and I'm assuming you don't mean the books in the Old Testament, either) then how exactly are they stories of the Bible? :lol:

Fact of the matter is, a group of men sat in a conference and picked and chose which stories they were going to include in the "Bible" so they could project the image that they wanted. That of a Divine being who walked on the earth, died, and was resurrected. Not that of a regular man with possibly a wife, who was simply a man of great self-worth and charisma.

Further, what does the fact that the names of the days of the week are Norse in origin have to do with stories that may or may not be in the Bible? Lots of Pagan rituals and lore has been handed down and survives today. Things like Christmas(the Pagan ceremony of Yule), to name a big one. It still has no bearing or relevance to the topic.

there actually is something...
1st corrinthians 15:3-8, jesus proved his resurrection by appearing to people
matt 18:19-20, jesus is here, god does anything we ask
so jesus is already here, it would be trivial for him to appear, but it's ok to if we ask it of him
so get some buddies, and ask him to physically appear so you know he's resurrected
just something like
"dear jesus, we know you are here in our midst already, we ask you to physically appear so that we know you are resurrected. we have faith that you will answer our prayer as you promised in the bible, in your name we pray, amen."

...and nothing happens

So we are to accept the single source as evidence? That's not smart. Any journalist will tell you that you have to corroborate your information. Can that be corroborated by anything else, other than another story in the Bible?

actually, several species of homosapian were wiped out throughout history, they each had their own unique physical identifications, but in most cases it was a lack of inventing tools

For someone who just put off someone else as not understanding Darwin's theory, you certainly showed you have little understanding of our evolution. Not all humans have been Homo Sapiens, and no "species" of Homo Sapiens has ever been killed off. Now, other species of humans, like Homo Erectus, aka Neanderthals, have died out completely.

 

[DeletedUser26129]

Ockham's razor...

the simplest explanation or strategy tends to be the best one.


Its more logic to believe in evolution then in god...

However religion never existed out of logic lol.

 

[Overvoltage]

And this is relevant why?

because you're saying the bible is a magical book of perfectness that fits together with only a few gigantic holes even though it had a bunch of authors; and I'm saying it's because they rearranged the events and excluded some parts from it

Again thats written, not proof imo...

it's in your magic bible

I actualy do know it as i studied it, however i simplyfied it....

it has absolutely nothing to do with "man evolving from monkeys", so no, you have no idea what it is

I am aware of that, however you already awnsered it yoruself... they lacked to do what we are able to do.

which is why evolution works

 

[DeletedUser]

Wrong:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Major_religious_groups

[SPOIL]Religious category Number of followers Cultural tradition Main regions covered
Christianity 2,100,000,000 – 2,200,000,000[6][7] Abrahamic religions Predominant in the Western world (Europe, the Americas, Oceania), Sub-Saharan Africa and the Philippines. Minorities worldwide, see Christianity by country.
Islam 1,300,000,000 – 1,600,000,000[8][9] Abrahamic religions Middle East, Northern Africa, Central Asia, South Asia, Western Africa, Indian subcontinent, Malay Archipelago with large population centers existing in Eastern Africa, Balkan Peninsula, Russia, Europe and China.[/SPOIL]




.

It is true that Islam is not the more numerous
But the spread of Islam the fastest in the world

The Messenger of God

​

((Forward to say this is a total night and day, God does not leave the house trainers and honoring God only enter this noble glory of religion or servile attributed It is difficult to make God in Islam, his family and humiliation humiliated by God kufr))
Fast-growing Islam winning converts in
Western world


Around 30,000 women in Switzerland have converted to Islam, according to a recent report by an organisation for Muslim women​

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/Putting_their_faith_in_Islam.html?cid=4264476

 

[DeletedUser]

That's besides the point. It's still not the largest, which is what was claimed.

 

[DeletedUser]

I'm religious (I don't go to church every Sunday but I still place a great deal of value in my own personal faith) and have a science background, so I personally don't think they're mutually exclusive.

Either way as long as either side of the debate respects each other's views/opinions that's the main thing (which is often harder than it should be thanks to science and religion both claiming to have the moral/intellectual high ground over one another), there's nothing more despicable than people attacking each other because of their personal beliefs, regardless of how virtuous they think their own arguement is.

The only other thing I will add is that there is frequent examples of evolution around us on a daily basis, i.e. bacteria super resistant to antibiotics, but I'll leave it for the proponent's of Darwin's theory to go into detail on "

 

[DeletedUser]

science is back by facts. did evolution happen yes. there is facts!

does god exist? anyone feel free to point out hard evidance??????? noop no god it seems

i would get really into this but it gets to long. but fact is there is no dispute among the scientific community over the subject evolution is scientific fact. SCIENTIST! the are the guys that put us on the moon! the reason we have jumbo jets. advanced medical procedures! i think you can take their word for it...

 

[DeletedUser]

I'm religious (I don't go to church every Sunday but I still place a great deal of value in my own personal faith) and have a science background, so I personally don't think they're mutually exclusive.

Either way as long as either side of the debate respects each other's views/opinions that's the main thing (which is often harder than it should be thanks to science and religion both claiming to have the moral/intellectual high ground over one another), there's nothing more despicable than people attacking each other because of their personal beliefs, regardless of how virtuous they think their own arguement is.

The only other thing I will add is that there is frequent examples of evolution around us on a daily basis, i.e. bacteria super resistant to antibiotics, but I'll leave it for the proponent's of Darwin's theory to go into detail on "

sorry bro, but im gona have to go ahead and attack religion a little bit. its got no rational proof or evidance of any kind. and no one, no one! can say the after life is real. despite if it is or not theres nothing to prove it

theres nothing to base these "opinions" on?

i think of religion as man fairy tales to explane the world.

in the words of bill maher. "a guy flying around the world handing out presents, i dont beilve that.... but a guy who can hear everybody pray, THAT I GET!"

 

[DeletedUser]

i would get really into this but it gets to long. but fact is there is no dispute among the scientific community over the subject evolution is scientific fact. SCIENTIST! the are the guys that put us on the moon! the reason we have jumbo jets. advanced medical procedures! i think you can take their word for it...

You are actually quite wrong. The views of the worlds scientists can be as different as the views of the world's religions. Not all scientists accept Evolution as outlined by Darwin. Ever heard the term, Intelligent Design? It is an attempt to reconcile scientific knowledge with religious tenants.

 

[DeletedUser]

You are actually quite wrong. The views of the worlds scientists can be as different as the views of the world's religions. Not all scientists accept Evolution as outlined by Darwin. Ever heard the term, Intelligent Design? It is an attempt to reconcile scientific knowledge with religious tenants.

But Intelligent Design is not science.

You are right though, besides your chosen example. That is also the power behind science, if you get new proof, then you change your theory, test it and confirm or abandon it. If a confirmed theory is proved wrong, well then another one will be found eventually.

And besides, Evolution is not confirmed at all. And I say that not as a religious person, but as a person who think Darwin got it almost right in the first go.

 

[DeletedUser]

But Intelligent Design is not science.

You are right though, besides your chosen example. That is also the power behind science, if you get new proof, then you change your theory, test it and confirm or abandon it. If a confirmed theory is proved wrong, well then another one will be found eventually.

And besides, Evolution is not confirmed at all. And I say that not as a religious person, but as a person who think Darwin got it almost right in the first go.

I never said it was Science. :lol:

It is true, though, that there are several prominent people in the scientific community who believe in Intelligent Design.

 

[DeletedUser]

It is true, though, that there are several prominent people in the scientific community who believe in Intelligent Design.

Yup sadly there are :icon_twisted:

 

[DeletedUser]

Falseness of the theory of evolution
the evidence for that is that Allaah has described in the Qur’aan the stages of the creation of Adam. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“Verily, the likeness of ‘Eesa (Jesus) before Allaah is the likeness of Adam. He created him from dust, then (He) said to him: ‘Be!’ — and he was”
[Aal ‘Imraan 3:59]
This dust was moistened until it became sticky mud or clay that stuck to the hands. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“And indeed We created man (Adam) out of an extract of clay (water and earth)”
[al-Mu’minoon 23:12]
“Verily, We created them of a sticky clay”
[al-Saaffaat 37:12]
Then it became dried (sounding) clay of altered mud. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“And indeed, We created man from dried (sounding) clay of altered mud”
[al-Hijr 15:26]
Then when it dried it became sounding clay like the clay of pottery. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“He created man (Adam) from sounding clay like the clay of pottery”
[al-Rahmaan 55:14]
Then Allaah moulded it into the form that He wanted and breathed into him (his) soul created by Him. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“(Remember) when your Lord said to the angels: ‘Truly, I am going to create man from clay’.
So when I have fashioned him and breathed into him (his) soul created by Me, then you fall down prostrate to him”
[Saad 38:71-72]
These are the stages through which the creation of Adam passed according to the Qur’aan. As for the stages of creation which the progeny of Adam pass through, Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“And indeed We created man (Adam) out of an extract of clay (water and earth).
Thereafter We made him (the offspring of Adam) as a Nutfah (mixed drops of the male and female sexual discharge and lodged it) in a safe lodging (womb of the woman).
Then We made the Nutfah into a clot (a piece of thick coagulated blood), then We made the clot into a little lump of flesh, then We made out of that little lump of flesh bones, then We clothed the bones with flesh, and then We brought it forth as another creation. So Blessed is Allaah, the Best of creators”
[al-Mu’minoon 23:12-14]
With regard to the wife of Adam – Hawwa’ (Eve) – Allaah tells us that He created her from him, as He says (interpretation of the meaning):
“O mankind! Be dutiful to your Lord, Who created you from a single person (Adam), and from him (Adam) He created his wife [Hawwa (Eve)], and from them both He created many men and women”
[al-Nisa’ 4:1]

 

[DeletedUser]

Falseness of the theory of evolution
the evidence for that is that Allaah has described in the Qur’aan the stages of the creation of Adam. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“Verily, the likeness of ‘Eesa (Jesus) before Allaah is the likeness of Adam. He created him from dust, then (He) said to him: ‘Be!’ — and he was”
[Aal ‘Imraan 3:59]
This dust was moistened until it became sticky mud or clay that stuck to the hands. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“And indeed We created man (Adam) out of an extract of clay (water and earth)”
[al-Mu’minoon 23:12]
“Verily, We created them of a sticky clay”
[al-Saaffaat 37:12]
Then it became dried (sounding) clay of altered mud. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“And indeed, We created man from dried (sounding) clay of altered mud”
[al-Hijr 15:26]
Then when it dried it became sounding clay like the clay of pottery. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“He created man (Adam) from sounding clay like the clay of pottery”
[al-Rahmaan 55:14]
Then Allaah moulded it into the form that He wanted and breathed into him (his) soul created by Him. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“(Remember) when your Lord said to the angels: ‘Truly, I am going to create man from clay’.
So when I have fashioned him and breathed into him (his) soul created by Me, then you fall down prostrate to him”
[Saad 38:71-72]
These are the stages through which the creation of Adam passed according to the Qur’aan. As for the stages of creation which the progeny of Adam pass through, Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“And indeed We created man (Adam) out of an extract of clay (water and earth).
Thereafter We made him (the offspring of Adam) as a Nutfah (mixed drops of the male and female sexual discharge and lodged it) in a safe lodging (womb of the woman).
Then We made the Nutfah into a clot (a piece of thick coagulated blood), then We made the clot into a little lump of flesh, then We made out of that little lump of flesh bones, then We clothed the bones with flesh, and then We brought it forth as another creation. So Blessed is Allaah, the Best of creators”
[al-Mu’minoon 23:12-14]
With regard to the wife of Adam – Hawwa’ (Eve) – Allaah tells us that He created her from him, as He says (interpretation of the meaning):
“O mankind! Be dutiful to your Lord, Who created you from a single person (Adam), and from him (Adam) He created his wife [Hawwa (Eve)], and from them both He created many men and women”
[al-Nisa’ 4:1]

Are you using that as your argumentation for the falsehood of the idea of Evolution? Or am I missing something (Might very well be lol) ?

I think what you just wrote, more or less proves the point in this debate. As long as we find our 'proofs' in different genres, then we can't agree, because the very principle in these genres vary from one extreme to the other. (Religion - Science).

 

[DeletedUser]

Falseness of the theory of evolution
the evidence for that is that Allaah has described in the Qur’aan the stages of the creation of Adam. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“Verily, the likeness of ‘Eesa (Jesus) before Allaah is the likeness of Adam. He created him from dust, then (He) said to him: ‘Be!’ — and he was”
[Aal ‘Imraan 3:59]
This dust was moistened until it became sticky mud or clay that stuck to the hands. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“And indeed We created man (Adam) out of an extract of clay (water and earth)”
[al-Mu’minoon 23:12]
“Verily, We created them of a sticky clay”
[al-Saaffaat 37:12]
Then it became dried (sounding) clay of altered mud. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“And indeed, We created man from dried (sounding) clay of altered mud”
[al-Hijr 15:26]
Then when it dried it became sounding clay like the clay of pottery. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“He created man (Adam) from sounding clay like the clay of pottery”
[al-Rahmaan 55:14]
Then Allaah moulded it into the form that He wanted and breathed into him (his) soul created by Him. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“(Remember) when your Lord said to the angels: ‘Truly, I am going to create man from clay’.
So when I have fashioned him and breathed into him (his) soul created by Me, then you fall down prostrate to him”
[Saad 38:71-72]
These are the stages through which the creation of Adam passed according to the Qur’aan. As for the stages of creation which the progeny of Adam pass through, Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“And indeed We created man (Adam) out of an extract of clay (water and earth).
Thereafter We made him (the offspring of Adam) as a Nutfah (mixed drops of the male and female sexual discharge and lodged it) in a safe lodging (womb of the woman).
Then We made the Nutfah into a clot (a piece of thick coagulated blood), then We made the clot into a little lump of flesh, then We made out of that little lump of flesh bones, then We clothed the bones with flesh, and then We brought it forth as another creation. So Blessed is Allaah, the Best of creators”
[al-Mu’minoon 23:12-14]
With regard to the wife of Adam – Hawwa’ (Eve) – Allaah tells us that He created her from him, as He says (interpretation of the meaning):
“O mankind! Be dutiful to your Lord, Who created you from a single person (Adam), and from him (Adam) He created his wife [Hawwa (Eve)], and from them both He created many men and women”
[al-Nisa’ 4:1]

How does something made of clay ejaculate?