Podcast 87 discussion!

Lord Ike

Non-stop Poster
Ike you realise you dont have to record and upload interview on Wednesday, you do have an entire week to do it...



W87 is dead
Work every other day but Monday,tuesday,wednesday So try to have 1 day free for the girlfriend and i try to record the other 2 days just to keep it going.
 

King Dreaded

Guest
Okay I've been asked to respond to this by a number of people, so I'll respond to the video and some other common questions.




To start off, I did not release statements claiming players to be doing anything when I set them for internal. The reasons were very simple, it would either be a lack of growth, not enough activity, or not enough or any participation. This, mixed with being a liability because of their location and expected conflicts. I didn't and still don't feel it necessary to explain to tribe members where I expect political conflict in many cases as it is not their job to deal with diplomacy, it is mine. In the case of nearly every internal it was an attempt to keep the discipline in check and remove liabilities for the future. We all known what a nightmare it is when you find out a front player is less than capable, inactive etc. Most of these were set in a list in council to be dealt with while I was on vacation, so in the case of sirsumtances, that is a mix up on their part. A lot of the issues in the last weeks come from this. I left from early july until july 27th. As Gabe said in a post, that is where silence came from. I quite literally did everything in council and just had advisors, and many could not fill the shoes even remotely. Some could, thank you to Ofir and Kekua for trying your best, as well as Triston.

I initially predicted RAGE's downfall. I saw after us pushing S3XY that while we had some good on the front, the backline and midline were for the most part not capable of operating at the necessary skill level. With a number of political threats looming, and the time schedule not allowing for any time to clean up enough, I understood that RAGE could not last and that I could not push the majority to fight as would be needed. Navarian was correct in his analysis of OPs. While the assigning and pre-op was tight and thorough, the execution by players was poor in many cases. They just could not get their heads around mandatory land times or timed fakes or things like that. No matter how the issue was approached, even if threatened with removal or pushed along nicely,

All that being said, I approached Mutiny before i left and told them I wanted to discuss a merge when I returned. I didn't want the good players in RAGE who were loyal and coordinated to suffer because the majority refused discipline or teamwork at a necessary level. However all these attempts to salvage the tribe got severely messed up when Condolences, out of fear and stupidity, fled RAGE [a council member] to make his own rebel tribe, because he was mad that I made a comment in my other tribe chat about the failings of RAGE and joked about declaring on the world. The joke of course was that the world wanted to declare on us anyway. He knew better, he chose opportunism and thus screwed many of the tribe members in this process. They then attacked me on vacation, which is my own issue, however it made dealing with tribe jumping and diplomacy not much of an option as much of the tribes morale was hurt by this, and we became a target. At this point i decided that I should remove all members before they become refugees when we are swarmed on, and messaged tribe leaders giving them advice on good players to take. On that note too, he was scared because he was spread all over the map from internals despite my constant advice to him to keep himself on one front and not spread his fights. This likely all aided the reasons for jumping.

In all cases except Ghio this was the case. While it was also for the lulz, Steve was simply out of hand. I explained already on that post quite clearly why, and anyone that knows the account knows why I did it. I think it's fitting anyway, he can play with his botting friends in PTG. And before I get the random account that comes on here to claim they don't do that, I have evidence and a link to the botting website that K2 Fire contributes to that you all post on. If it wasn't for the fact that innogames doesn't ban anyone anymore, you would all be gone. Anyone wishing to see this link may message me on skype and i'll provide proof. I acquired this through a korean player who was betrayed by his friends in PTG and leaked this to me.


Regarding nuke land times. They were not set to land before my own nukes or nobles. I never assigned anyone to the targets i was taking. If I took anything, I was straight forward with the player about needing help clearing. They were set to random times because I dont believe in flashy land times at 0:00:00 that are easy to tag. That defeats the purpose of knowing offline times. I assigned random land times within a 15 minute gap with some players set to land same second close in proximity and others to land clearing nukes to break lazy support landing before hand and disguise attempts until the last second. That is the reasoning for that, not to pre nuke myself in. I can't believe i have to explain something like this to be honest. I already had explained this when asked by members before. On this note further, I always participated in Cat Ops, posted reports of me clearing, and when the tribe failed to take the 2 remaining Ghio villages I assigned, I posted a photo of my nukes incoming and told people to send. So let's not give credence to this claim. It's nonsense. I always play for team.


Regarding Eriks comments on my opinions on other tribes. Erik, if you have an issue with me, present truth. Don't make up things. I have old friends in Mutiny and I have friends in STD and I respect both of them. Some of Mutiny I have fought alongside or lead before (pack i wish you didn't quit). That is just simply not true. Like the main account owner said, you are new. Maybe this is why you were so confused by so much. Maybe instead of complaining you should have been more pro-active in learning how to attack properly. Then again, it was you the other day asking me how to time wasn't it? (it was).

I challenge you to present any evidence of me saying these things.

Regarding fighting PTG, maybe you should have read more on the forums. I was sitting Art of Defense nearly the entire time in its campaign to fight PTG. This was an account that fled PTG after being sick of its leadership. We defended a very large number of full village OPs and kept positive for awhile until we had no troops left. My co players played it 24/7 to help PR and Tampara as much as possible as the South was the weak area for PTG. What finally made us cancel our relationship with PR, was that after numerous attempts at explaining to Ben how to properly plan an OP, he would ignore it and make a stupid decision and hurt his tribe. While Tampara was being opped in the south, we had just nuke raided the souths front and killed off about 20 trains in the last week and nukes in defending, PR decided to screw us by opping Niceday in the North instead of the weak players in the south and thus Tampara decided to quit and they lost the best asset they had against PTG. That is why we cancelled that relationship. I am glad Ryan [DarknessCalls has a better tribe now, he deserves it]. I will admit my mistake in allying them, they were worse than i could have possibly imagined. I would give ben intel on troop movements and he still could not deliver.

Simply put, we went into alliance with PR expecting it to hold its own and fight well. When Ben continuously made poor decisions and failed to be effective with his tribe or the support we gave, I stopped giving defensive support. He was too stubborn and was incapable of fighting. I wasn't going to sink my tribe to save another tribe lead by someone who wanted to keep launching 30 hour trains.

Hopefully this clears things up, the rest of the clear up I left in the tribe description. Like I said, RAGE in a sense was an experiment about how far I could push a bunch of random players in a tribe I randomly took leadership in. I pushed it the farthest it could go, but as is shown, the journey had to end. I could have kept going, but it only would have served to harm the players in the tribe that were good.
 

King Dreaded

Guest
Anyway it's been a pleasure meeting many of you. I look forward to the STD vs Mutiny showdown. That will be a good fight. Perhaps I will return and jump on an account, we will see.


I will now be playing on 89. I will release my username and tribe location in 2 months, though i'm sure if anyone is curious enough they can figure it out, though I doubt they are. For anyone there, I look forward to a good world. And for those here, thanks for your time, again, it's been fun. Any more questions regarding this can be asked of me on Skype as I don't feel that I will be on these forums too much
 

Lord Ike

Non-stop Poster
Regarding nuke land times. They were not set to land before my own nukes or nobles. I never assigned anyone to the targets i was taking. If I took anything, I was straight forward with the player about needing help clearing. They were set to random times because I dont believe in flashy land times at 0:00:00 that are easy to tag. That defeats the purpose of knowing offline times. I assigned random land times within a 15 minute gap with some players set to land same second close in proximity and others to land clearing nukes to break lazy support landing before hand and disguise attempts until the last second. That is the reasoning for that, not to pre nuke myself in. I can't believe i have to explain something like this to be honest. I already had explained this when asked by members before. On this note further, I always participated in Cat Ops, posted reports of me clearing, and when the tribe failed to take the 2 remaining Ghio villages I assigned, I posted a photo of my nukes incoming and told people to send. So let's not give credence to this claim. It's nonsense. I always play for team.
You seem to have misunderstood what was actually said, A source told me which to be fair I dunno if I'd believe this or not but it was funny to listen to the reaction was that, You sent your nobles and gave everyone else a land time round it for there targets. Mostly as a joke as you would expect from an interview on a topic that has already run dry so to speak. Nonetheless I'm an entertainer nothing more nothing less.
 

s u stephen

blocked
Okay I've been asked to respond to this by a number of people, so I'll respond to the video and some other common questions.




To start off, I did not release statements claiming players to be doing anything when I set them for internal. The reasons were very simple, it would either be a lack of growth, not enough activity, or not enough or any participation. This, mixed with being a liability because of their location and expected conflicts. I didn't and still don't feel it necessary to explain to tribe members where I expect political conflict in many cases as it is not their job to deal with diplomacy, it is mine. In the case of nearly every internal it was an attempt to keep the discipline in check and remove liabilities for the future. We all known what a nightmare it is when you find out a front player is less than capable, inactive etc. Most of these were set in a list in council to be dealt with while I was on vacation, so in the case of sirsumtances, that is a mix up on their part. A lot of the issues in the last weeks come from this. I left from early july until july 27th. As Gabe said in a post, that is where silence came from. I quite literally did everything in council and just had advisors, and many could not fill the shoes even remotely. Some could, thank you to Ofir and Kekua for trying your best, as well as Triston.

I initially predicted RAGE's downfall. I saw after us pushing S3XY that while we had some good on the front, the backline and midline were for the most part not capable of operating at the necessary skill level. With a number of political threats looming, and the time schedule not allowing for any time to clean up enough, I understood that RAGE could not last and that I could not push the majority to fight as would be needed. Navarian was correct in his analysis of OPs. While the assigning and pre-op was tight and thorough, the execution by players was poor in many cases. They just could not get their heads around mandatory land times or timed fakes or things like that. No matter how the issue was approached, even if threatened with removal or pushed along nicely,

All that being said, I approached Mutiny before i left and told them I wanted to discuss a merge when I returned. I didn't want the good players in RAGE who were loyal and coordinated to suffer because the majority refused discipline or teamwork at a necessary level. However all these attempts to salvage the tribe got severely messed up when Condolences, out of fear and stupidity, fled RAGE [a council member] to make his own rebel tribe, because he was mad that I made a comment in my other tribe chat about the failings of RAGE and joked about declaring on the world. The joke of course was that the world wanted to declare on us anyway. He knew better, he chose opportunism and thus screwed many of the tribe members in this process. They then attacked me on vacation, which is my own issue, however it made dealing with tribe jumping and diplomacy not much of an option as much of the tribes morale was hurt by this, and we became a target. At this point i decided that I should remove all members before they become refugees when we are swarmed on, and messaged tribe leaders giving them advice on good players to take. On that note too, he was scared because he was spread all over the map from internals despite my constant advice to him to keep himself on one front and not spread his fights. This likely all aided the reasons for jumping.

In all cases except Ghio this was the case. While it was also for the lulz, Steve was simply out of hand. I explained already on that post quite clearly why, and anyone that knows the account knows why I did it. I think it's fitting anyway, he can play with his botting friends in PTG. And before I get the random account that comes on here to claim they don't do that, I have evidence and a link to the botting website that K2 Fire contributes to that you all post on. If it wasn't for the fact that innogames doesn't ban anyone anymore, you would all be gone. Anyone wishing to see this link may message me on skype and i'll provide proof. I acquired this through a korean player who was betrayed by his friends in PTG and leaked this to me.


Regarding nuke land times. They were not set to land before my own nukes or nobles. I never assigned anyone to the targets i was taking. If I took anything, I was straight forward with the player about needing help clearing. They were set to random times because I dont believe in flashy land times at 0:00:00 that are easy to tag. That defeats the purpose of knowing offline times. I assigned random land times within a 15 minute gap with some players set to land same second close in proximity and others to land clearing nukes to break lazy support landing before hand and disguise attempts until the last second. That is the reasoning for that, not to pre nuke myself in. I can't believe i have to explain something like this to be honest. I already had explained this when asked by members before. On this note further, I always participated in Cat Ops, posted reports of me clearing, and when the tribe failed to take the 2 remaining Ghio villages I assigned, I posted a photo of my nukes incoming and told people to send. So let's not give credence to this claim. It's nonsense. I always play for team.


Regarding Eriks comments on my opinions on other tribes. Erik, if you have an issue with me, present truth. Don't make up things. I have old friends in Mutiny and I have friends in STD and I respect both of them. Some of Mutiny I have fought alongside or lead before (pack i wish you didn't quit). That is just simply not true. Like the main account owner said, you are new. Maybe this is why you were so confused by so much. Maybe instead of complaining you should have been more pro-active in learning how to attack properly. Then again, it was you the other day asking me how to time wasn't it? (it was).

I challenge you to present any evidence of me saying these things.

Regarding fighting PTG, maybe you should have read more on the forums. I was sitting Art of Defense nearly the entire time in its campaign to fight PTG. This was an account that fled PTG after being sick of its leadership. We defended a very large number of full village OPs and kept positive for awhile until we had no troops left. My co players played it 24/7 to help PR and Tampara as much as possible as the South was the weak area for PTG. What finally made us cancel our relationship with PR, was that after numerous attempts at explaining to Ben how to properly plan an OP, he would ignore it and make a stupid decision and hurt his tribe. While Tampara was being opped in the south, we had just nuke raided the souths front and killed off about 20 trains in the last week and nukes in defending, PR decided to screw us by opping Niceday in the North instead of the weak players in the south and thus Tampara decided to quit and they lost the best asset they had against PTG. That is why we cancelled that relationship. I am glad Ryan [DarknessCalls has a better tribe now, he deserves it]. I will admit my mistake in allying them, they were worse than i could have possibly imagined. I would give ben intel on troop movements and he still could not deliver.

Simply put, we went into alliance with PR expecting it to hold its own and fight well. When Ben continuously made poor decisions and failed to be effective with his tribe or the support we gave, I stopped giving defensive support. He was too stubborn and was incapable of fighting. I wasn't going to sink my tribe to save another tribe lead by someone who wanted to keep launching 30 hour trains.

Hopefully this clears things up, the rest of the clear up I left in the tribe description. Like I said, RAGE in a sense was an experiment about how far I could push a bunch of random players in a tribe I randomly took leadership in. I pushed it the farthest it could go, but as is shown, the journey had to end. I could have kept going, but it only would have served to harm the players in the tribe that were good.
If you refer out of hand as to laying low and acting like a good member, then I guess I was the most bonkers member ever. The only times I was in internal forums was to give advice and nobody inside RAGE! except you even know I was back on the account. Suck up your shit and move on.
 

navarian

Active Member
As expected, we've got a bunch of nonsense that whilst looks and sounds like you've got some sort of answer for everything, is actually bullshit. Given the time to read though the book you wrote for us I can conclude that the only thing you actually disputed were the comments that Eric stated regarding your thoughts on the other top tribes. Not only that but you decided to pawn all of PR's shortcomings off on Ben, when in actual fact you know just as well as I do that there was an infinite number of things you could have done to help PR, you just didn't give a shit.

Alas, best of luck on 89, I'm glad to see the back of you.
Nav.
 

the nemesis123

Guest
DISCLAIMER: Keep in mind I wrote this on a bus yesterday so it isn't updated with all the conversation here.


I enjoyed this interview enough to comment on it, but I did want to address a few points made.

I am not advocating the actions that anyone took and do not know what I would have done in that particular position, but I do have a tinge of sympathy for Dreaded, being a fellow leader.

I think leading is easily the most difficult thing you can do in TW, which is part of the reason I am learning myself to become a world class leader, it is the job with the most pressure and frustration but also most reward in Tribal Wars. Certainly I have my own flaws, rules established partly due to past experience and partly due to being autistic that prevent me from ever being able to become the complete package leader. I rarely talk to those outside the tribe, unlike most leaders who are chatterboxes, I do not trust them in the game or try to get to know them outside of the game and I do not use spies for this reason either. To put it simply, I prefer playing PvE rather than PvP; the victory condition in my mind is always having the better force and outplaying on the battlefield. There are other issues I won’t really get into but I wanted to use just one example.

My point here is that Dreaded probably isn’t perfect and to expect a leader to have no flaws whatsoever and not to do things that you disagree with is foolish. Leaders often get blamed for tribes failing and whilst it is true that the leader holds most of the responsibility and I would be falling on my sword (unlike Dreaded I believe) if STD failed, my perception was that Dreaded, overall, was a pretty good leader. My impression of Dreaded, as an opposing leader, was that he was mostly acting in the best interests of his tribe, that he pushed his members to become better and succeed more than nearly all the tribes out there (my own tribe being one such exception). When it comes to leaders, you could have gotten a lot worse within W87, even within the tribes still remaining.

With regards to Ghio, it is my personal opinion that Dreaded had already given up by that stage and had stopped playing for the interest of the tribe. There are two reasons for this, firstly the tribe was not very good. The co-ordination, contrary to what I’ve heard was never very good, not in comparison to its neighbours. Mutiny was better, S3XY was better, STD was better even though the former two were overall weaker tribes. Dreaded needed to rely on those diplomatic plays to keep Rage relevant and I think it annoyed him. My characterization of him from our brief conversations is that he is similar to myself in that he is a perfectionist who had been in better tribes than Rage in the past. For me it was very difficult to accept that the general standard in W87 was lower than past worlds, that it would be far harder to create top tier tribes in the same way I could in the past.

On top of that, he made two major mistakes. The first was allying PR, in my opinion P.T.G were the better choice. Of course the ideal choice would have been STD, but we are not open to diplomacy. PR was not strong enough to take on PTG and BAN and make it a reasonable fight; in fact it is somewhat a miracle they did not lose more. PR simply did not have the leadership or player base to fight PTG/BAN. It is one of those cases that if STD had joined in, Rage and PR would probably still be around today but we didn’t. That fact that we existed in an important position and the fact we were strong enough to win even steep gangbangs in the local area meaning that we couldn’t be replaced by a tribe more malleable like ABC really gave Rage trouble.

The second was getting too big. Rage brought itself too much attention and set itself up for a gangbang. That world war was going to happen regardless because recruiting from PR was one step too far, even if there was no clear correct answer. Dreaded wasn’t going crazy, it was something he knew would happen but he had just given up. I think though that this is something that leaders don’t pay enough attention to though, even at the high levels. I’m pretty sure Dreaded knew that being big would make people afraid of Rage, but he didn’t quite have that fine tuning down in my opinion.

I do apologise for boring people with what is essentially a long rant, I thought I’d just put my two cents in and say Dreaded was probably not as bad as people from Rage think given the emotionally charged abrupt ending to the tribe and put a lot of work in trying to make the tribe succeed even if there were some questionable decisions I do think most of them were in the interests of Rage and I hope someone says likewise about me if STD was to fail.